Lead Certification Questi
Click here for Top Ten Discussions. CLICK HERE for Q & A Homepage
Receive Free Rental Owner Updates Email:  
MrLandlord Q & A
     
     
Lead Certification Questi (by John [NJ]) Nov 23, 2023 11:52 PM
       Lead Certification Questi (by Steve [MA]) Nov 24, 2023 5:55 AM
       Lead Certification Questi (by Mapleaf18 [NY]) Nov 24, 2023 7:26 AM
       Lead Certification Questi (by tryan [MA]) Nov 24, 2023 7:31 AM
       Lead Certification Questi (by John [NJ]) Nov 24, 2023 7:43 AM
       Lead Certification Questi (by Steve [MA]) Nov 24, 2023 8:44 AM
       Lead Certification Questi (by zero [IN]) Nov 24, 2023 9:54 AM
       Lead Certification Questi (by John [NJ]) Nov 24, 2023 10:14 AM
       Lead Certification Questi (by zero [IN]) Nov 24, 2023 11:01 AM
       Lead Certification Questi (by Vee [OH]) Nov 24, 2023 11:47 AM
       Lead Certification Questi (by Pat [VA]) Nov 24, 2023 12:42 PM
       Lead Certification Questi (by don [PA]) Nov 24, 2023 1:42 PM
       Lead Certification Questi (by mapleaf18 [NY]) Nov 24, 2023 2:16 PM
       Lead Certification Questi (by ed [CA]) Nov 24, 2023 3:32 PM
       Lead Certification Questi (by John [NJ]) Nov 24, 2023 7:58 PM
       Lead Certification Questi (by Pat [VA]) Nov 24, 2023 8:01 PM
       Lead Certification Questi (by Allym [NJ]) Nov 24, 2023 8:46 PM
       Lead Certification Questi (by don [PA]) Nov 24, 2023 8:57 PM
       Lead Certification Questi (by Steve [MA]) Nov 25, 2023 7:15 AM
       Lead Certification Questi (by tryan [MA]) Nov 25, 2023 8:06 AM
       Lead Certification Questi (by tryan [MA]) Nov 25, 2023 8:18 AM
       Lead Certification Questi (by John [NJ]) Nov 25, 2023 9:15 AM
       Lead Certification Questi (by Tony [NJ]) Nov 25, 2023 10:34 AM
       Lead Certification Questi (by Allym [NJ]) Nov 25, 2023 5:11 PM
       Lead Certification Questi (by Don [PA]) Nov 25, 2023 9:17 PM
       Lead Certification Questi (by Robert J [CA]) Nov 25, 2023 11:32 PM
       Lead Certification Questi (by zero [IN]) Nov 26, 2023 11:55 AM
       Lead Certification Questi (by John [NJ]) Nov 26, 2023 9:39 PM
       Lead Certification Questi (by Tony [NJ]) Nov 26, 2023 10:09 PM
       Lead Certification Questi (by GLR [MA]) Nov 27, 2023 11:48 AM
       Lead Certification Questi (by GLR [MA]) Nov 27, 2023 11:48 AM
       Lead Certification Questi (by GLR [MA]) Nov 27, 2023 11:48 AM
       Lead Certification Questi (by Allym [NJ]) Nov 27, 2023 10:13 PM
       Lead Certification Questi (by zero [IN]) Nov 28, 2023 7:48 AM

Click here to reply to this discussion.
Click Here to send this discussion to a friend

Lead Certification Questi (by John [NJ]) Posted on: Nov 23, 2023 11:52 PM
Message:

It's been years since I posted here, but I'm still alive and have a question regarding lead-based paint inspections in rental dwelling units.

My small town in New Jersey is now requiring all rental units older than 1978 to be inspected for lead based paint and upon a satisfactory inspection and pass by 7/22/24. Failure to comply will resukt in fines up to $1,000 a week. To be specific, my rental unit must be lead compliant as per NJ P.L. 2021, c 182 and are required to obtain a Lead Safe Certification. Participation in this program is MANATORY.

My multi-family house dates back to the early 1900's. The exterior paint for the doors, windows and clapboard siding was in extremely rough shape, but over the years much of the paint work was completely redone by taking the lead based paint down to the wood and repainted with top quality paint and obviously containing NO lead. I only have about 6 more window frames and trim to complete and about 50 feet of soffits. I should meet the deadline although winter is coming making it hard to do the work.

My QYESTION is as follows: I have 3 detached garages on site and a small 2.5 story workshop on the property. None are for tenants and not for living in... The paint is rough and very old and without doubt contain lead. Will the inspection include these structures although 1) they are detached from the multi-family house and 2) None are for living in as well as renting.  This is New Jersey and other states may have different rules as for lead-based paints.

John

New Jersey

--24.228.x.xxx




Lead Certification Questi (by Steve [MA]) Posted on: Nov 24, 2023 5:55 AM
Message:

John, it's nice to know that you're still among us. As far as the outbuildings go, as long as the tenants have no access to the interiors those areas should be fine. However, any part of the exteriors of these building would have to be in compliance just like the main 2-unit building does. --72.93.xxx.xx




Lead Certification Questi (by Mapleaf18 [NY]) Posted on: Nov 24, 2023 7:26 AM
Message:

The fastest way would be to wall off the out bldgs from the public. I'm pretty sure those laws will be coming to our town as well as the "high lead level" stories are starting to crop up again and the lawyers are revving up their computers.

Of course they'd still find a way to get private LLs. --64.246.xxx.xxx




Lead Certification Questi (by tryan [MA]) Posted on: Nov 24, 2023 7:31 AM
Message:

I never had any "luck" scrapping and repainting. Always traces of lead left behind. What worked for me in the hood was removing the molding. Then run the sides thru a table saw to strip the sides then FLIP the board. Caulk the edge to "hide" the smaller width.

Door jambs and windows were replaced.

--198.168.xx.xxx




Lead Certification Questi (by John [NJ]) Posted on: Nov 24, 2023 7:43 AM
Message:

Thanks for the replies to all.

Steve [MA], glad to hear from you. The exterior of the out buildings have serious lead-based paint lifting on the trim for the windows and door. I got work on the house to do, but that is under control for the moment.

tyran[MA], from what I read, there can be lead based paint present, but it MUST be covered over with non-lead based paint and in good condition. In otherwords, no need to rip out all the trim completely and replace with new wood. As for the windows themselves, they have all been replaced with new window replacements over the past 20 years.

Well, looks like I better start removing the old peeling paint on the out buildings.......

John

New Jersey --24.228.x.xxx




Lead Certification Questi (by Steve [MA]) Posted on: Nov 24, 2023 8:44 AM
Message:

John, for the outbuildings it might be faster easier & less time consuming either to wrap the trim with coil stock or even wood or replace the trim & hang some vinyl siding especially if your facing time constraints. --72.93.xxx.xx




Lead Certification Questi (by zero [IN]) Posted on: Nov 24, 2023 9:54 AM
Message:

Just putting normal paint over lead paint doesn't keep you from getting a fail from what I have heard. You need to use a paint that encapsulates the lead. Read this as expensive.

Wrapping the outside would be a good solution. Possibly cheaper as well depending on how intricate the trim work is.

Running trim through a saw to get the paint off seems like a lot of work and extra lead dust in the place. If the trim is the big stuff that is hard to replace maybe flipping it over would be beneficial. Otherwise replacing it would be my goal. --107.147.xx.xxx




Lead Certification Questi (by John [NJ]) Posted on: Nov 24, 2023 10:14 AM
Message:

Wrapping is not possible on the big garage doors for vehicles. It would be far easier to remove the trim and replace, but the deciding factor is will a good scrapping and repainting with a high quality exterior paint be good enough? This is what I read. Nothing was stated about using a special lead encapsulation type paint. I'll have to dig into this by looking at the specifics under the mandate for NJ P.L. 2021 c 182.

John

New Jersey --24.228.x.xxx




Lead Certification Questi (by zero [IN]) Posted on: Nov 24, 2023 11:01 AM
Message:

I just did one quick search and this is what came up at the top.

Painting over lead paint can be considered a form of “encapsulation,” which is one of the EPA-approved ways to remediate lead paint hazards. However, this requires the use of a special material called an “encapsulant.” Regular store-bought paint by itself is not sufficient to safely encapsulate lead paint.

Check into it. I would hate for you to go through all the work only to find out it didn't bring you into compliance.

--107.147.xx.xxx




Lead Certification Questi (by Vee [OH]) Posted on: Nov 24, 2023 11:47 AM
Message:

I have been involved in the lead remediation in my county since 2003, recently many cities have taken off to have -lead safe- housing stock but in my big city the database contamination is as profound as the lead risk itself, an even mix of owner occupied and rental housing remediation has been ignored by the teams that wrote our lead testing rules. capping is very helpful over trim because it can be done in 12 foot sections, the vinyl siding is easy enough a handy owner can do it with a helper who can hold the end stable while the owner begins to fasten and meet the helper end. What we do here is wipe testing window frames, sills and a wide area of the floor below the windows, a wide area at the entry doors and a soils sample -almost every soil sample is well beyond the allowable indoor limit proving the leaded gasoline created much more neighboorhood lead than the painted surfaces which get worn and bumped, the irony is when walking animals are there the lead gets tracked into areas where animals meet people and this means kids and into the bedding thru the house, until recently our family has not allowed pets with the hope of not engaging fleas or feces problems - then came live comfort animals - so much for stuffed animals.... --184.59.xxx.xx




Lead Certification Questi (by Pat [VA]) Posted on: Nov 24, 2023 12:42 PM
Message:

Hi John! Good to know you are still among us! I remember you from when I joined in 2004! --216.126.xx.xxx




Lead Certification Questi (by don [PA]) Posted on: Nov 24, 2023 1:42 PM
Message:

Tryan--Running lead painted trim through a table saw??? You are creating a cloud of lead dust, exactly what you want to avoid! Pry the old lead painted trim off and trash it. Replace with new. You are being penny wise and pound foolish. --73.141.xxx.xxx




Lead Certification Questi (by mapleaf18 [NY]) Posted on: Nov 24, 2023 2:16 PM
Message:

Vee, "walking animals" oh you mean the FOUR legged kind LOL --64.246.xxx.xxx




Lead Certification Questi (by ed [CA]) Posted on: Nov 24, 2023 3:32 PM
Message:

Tools that might help would include a handheld power planer and/or a Wagner paint eater. --108.201.xx.xx




Lead Certification Questi (by John [NJ]) Posted on: Nov 24, 2023 7:58 PM
Message:

@Pat[VA]- Hi Pat. I visit once in a while to read. I think it was back in 2003-2004 when I was in full swing of fixing up things around here. I made many videos that were posted on this site, but I doubt they still exist. It was a fun time. If my memory is correct, I disappeared around 2010 as life changed for me. None the less, I've had a full house here and the rent has paud off my mortgage in 2018. Well, the new bump in the road is the lead base paint issue that I now face and I'll have to go full force to resole it or may be paying fines of up to $1000 a week. Now that winter approaches, it will be tough. Anyway, I hope all is well on your end.

John

New Jersey --174.206.xxx.xxx




Lead Certification Questi (by Pat [VA]) Posted on: Nov 24, 2023 8:01 PM
Message:

Yes we are fine, have 21 rentals, in our 70's, still like it.

Sure hope you breeze through your inspection. Wish things didn't get so complicated. --216.126.xx.xxx




Lead Certification Questi (by Allym [NJ]) Posted on: Nov 24, 2023 8:46 PM
Message:

Hi. I'm in NJ also and I remember your posts. Years ago when they first started talking about lead I got a guy to come out with an xray gun with a printout and he found where the lead was in my units and it was minimal. No walls and only the occasional window sill and one set of steps in the garage. So I still have the report he made and I hope that will get me through this. Another member last week, Vee, said that they use a wipe test on window sills and to make sure there is no dust on them. --173.61.xxx.xxx




Lead Certification Questi (by don [PA]) Posted on: Nov 24, 2023 8:57 PM
Message:

Ed---a power planer or "paint eater"??? Only if he wants to contaminate the whole house. Look, lead paint is hazardous when it is ingested. It is ingested either by kids eating flakes of peeling paint or touching lead dust, getting it on their hands, and putting their hands in their mouths. The lead paint HAZARD tests are wipe tests which test for the presence of lead dust. The inspector visually looks for peeling paint.

The LAST thing you want to do is disturb lead paint in such a way as to create any type of chips or dust! Read up on this stuff. Forget about the state requirement, you could face a huge lawsuit if a kid is contaminated and most insurance policies no longer cover the risk.

The only ways to remediated lead paint are to wet scrape it (time consuming and only works on flat surfaces), to use a chemical stripper (the only ones that I have seen that work have methylene chloride, which is a carcinogen), to physically cover the lead painted surface with a durable material, or to remove the object with lead paint and replace it. --73.141.xxx.xxx




Lead Certification Questi (by Steve [MA]) Posted on: Nov 25, 2023 7:15 AM
Message:

John, every time that I have to deal with a soiled carpet, I can't help but remember your classic video of eating off a yucky carpet after you cleaned it. --72.93.xxx.xx




Lead Certification Questi (by tryan [MA]) Posted on: Nov 25, 2023 8:06 AM
Message:

Just for clarification ... the table saw is set up is OUTSIdE so the lead dust is added to the already lead contaminated soil.

As far as the mess made removing it .... it's the same if your replacing it.

The problem we had getting a lead certificate in the hood is that the inspector used a hand held radar gadget to measure the lead. One told me it was a 100k piece of equipment (probably much cheaper now). Place this thing on the molding, press the button ... wallla! Lead level is shown.

Point being we could never pass this test by painting over lead paint. Had to remove it. --198.168.xx.xxx




Lead Certification Questi (by tryan [MA]) Posted on: Nov 25, 2023 8:18 AM
Message:

... alot of the molding in the hood were ornate. 5/8 in thick poplar with bulls-eyes in the 4 corners. Replacing with notty pine would a downgrade IMO. --198.168.xx.xxx




Lead Certification Questi (by John [NJ]) Posted on: Nov 25, 2023 9:15 AM
Message:

@AllyM - Thanks for your response. I remember you from the old days back when you came onto this forum. You had some very interesting and sometimes unusual posting that were fun and entertaining to read. Glad to meet with you again.

@Steve[MA] - I wish I still had that video, but that was over a decade and a half ago when it was recorded and posted, but a hard drive failure was the cause of a loss of many old videos. Do you remember the Royal Flush video? That was recorded in the very early 2000's for this site and posted here a long time ago. The video showed what can be flushed down an old toilet and was recorded when the low flush toilets were becoming the only available toilet in the day due to the regulations. Many of the first low flush toilets seemed to get clogged very easily. Believe it or not, the video is on YouTube and can be seen by going to Youtube and using the link below. Enjoy.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=GxMcK4W3fAg

John

New Jersey --24.228.x.xxx




Lead Certification Questi (by Tony [NJ]) Posted on: Nov 25, 2023 10:34 AM
Message:

Hi John. Remember me? Good to hear from you. --73.215.xxx.xx




Lead Certification Questi (by Allym [NJ]) Posted on: Nov 25, 2023 5:11 PM
Message:

If lead paint is ENCAPSULATED, covered with other new paint, it should be passed by the inspector except if it is on doors and windows that move and cause lead dust into the air. --173.61.xxx.xxx




Lead Certification Questi (by Don [PA]) Posted on: Nov 25, 2023 9:17 PM
Message:

Tryan—- sounds like they’re forbidding the very presence of lead paint if they are doing a gun test. In Philly they do a wipe test for dust and a visual for peeling. --73.194.xxx.xxx




Lead Certification Questi (by Robert J [CA]) Posted on: Nov 25, 2023 11:32 PM
Message:

Back in 1997, I took care of an entire apartment complex that had lead paint everywhere, on structure was built in 1907 and the second building in 1923. Basically I put over the walls and ceilings 1/4" drywall and butted it up to the baseboards and window frames. Those I covered with textured metal molding custom made to fit over the baseboards/moldings. So there was no lead paint exposed anywhere.

Using an XRF device I got every wall, ceiling, molding and door certified. Oh I covered over the thin 1/4" drywall with mud, orange peal, primer and two coats of paint.

A couple of years ago, during Covid (We still have it in Los Angeles), a squatter was advised by their free legal aid attorney to tear off some of the 1/4" drywall, place their babies bed along that wall and get tested for lead. Of course lead is now found.

I get sued for millions by my squatter and their attorney, free legal aid owned by the City of L.A. I show the judge my video of the encapsulation of the lead and how I had a permit, inspections and certifications. I tell the Judge that he needs to have a finding against the parents, free legal aid, the attorneys and the City.

A drug sniffing dog finds drugs in my car and unless I plead guilty to tenant endangerment, I'm cooked. Good thing I lent that car to the Judge, a friend he had the Sheriff's department go over the car before he parked it in the lot, visitors parking and not his assigned spot.

My case was dropped before the judge could rule. Corruption a thing in everyday life, unless us landlords pay the price, $1,000 a month to who ever asks. --47.155.xx.xxx




Lead Certification Questi (by zero [IN]) Posted on: Nov 26, 2023 11:55 AM
Message:

Someone is off his meds again --107.147.xx.xxx




Lead Certification Questi (by John [NJ]) Posted on: Nov 26, 2023 9:39 PM
Message:

@Tony[NJ] - Tony, sorry for the delayed response. I was very busy working on lead abatement on one of the windows up on the 3rd floor from start to finish including a very thorough clean up. Since I don't have a ladder long enough to reach, I was actually hanging out of the window frame (window glass was removed) to do all the work. My body 62 year old body is sore, but I'll recover.

I do recall you from the old days, but not sure if we had many conversations on the forum. It would be nice if this forum had backups of all posting going back 20 years that could be searched on. If so, let me know and it would be fun to see what we may have wrote about.

John

New Jersey --24.228.x.xxx




Lead Certification Questi (by Tony [NJ]) Posted on: Nov 26, 2023 10:09 PM
Message:

Here's a hint John - TAX APPEAL. --73.215.xxx.xx




Lead Certification Questi (by GLR [MA]) Posted on: Nov 27, 2023 11:48 AM
Message:

I just replaced all the exterior trim around windows on a triple decker with Azek/PVC... was cheaper to hire someone to 'renovate' then to scrape them. Came out great. Tip. Buy slightly larger wide azek planks, cut them down to the correct width. Use the excess as trim moulding around the window.

Same with the sills, used PVC sills.

I'll never have to worry about painting and i DEFINITELY know there is no lead in that trim.

Good luck --73.114.xxx.xxx




Lead Certification Questi (by GLR [MA]) Posted on: Nov 27, 2023 11:48 AM
Message:

I just replaced all the exterior trim around windows on a triple decker with Azek/PVC... was cheaper to hire someone to 'renovate' then to scrape them. Came out great. Tip. Buy slightly larger wide azek planks, cut them down to the correct width. Use the excess as trim moulding around the window.

Same with the sills, used PVC sills.

I'll never have to worry about painting and i DEFINITELY know there is no lead in that trim.

Good luck --73.114.xxx.xxx




Lead Certification Questi (by GLR [MA]) Posted on: Nov 27, 2023 11:48 AM
Message:

I just replaced all the exterior trim around windows on a triple decker with Azek/PVC... was cheaper to hire someone to 'renovate' then to scrape them. Came out great. Tip. Buy slightly larger wide azek planks, cut them down to the correct width. Use the excess as trim moulding around the window.

Same with the sills, used PVC sills.

I'll never have to worry about painting and i DEFINITELY know there is no lead in that trim.

Good luck --73.114.xxx.xxx




Lead Certification Questi (by Allym [NJ]) Posted on: Nov 27, 2023 10:13 PM
Message:

zero IN, yes, you are one. --173.61.xxx.xxx




Lead Certification Questi (by zero [IN]) Posted on: Nov 28, 2023 7:48 AM
Message:

I would have to be to believe even a quarter of the things some people rant about on here. --107.147.xx.xxx



Click Here to send this discussion to a friend
Report discussion to Webmaster


Reply:
Subject: RE: Lead Certification Questi
Your Name:
Your State:

Message:
Lead Certification Questi
Would you like to be notified via email when somebody replies to this thread?
If so, you must include your valid email address here. Do not add your address more than once per thread/subject. By entering your email address here, you agree to receive notification from Mrlandlord.com every time anyone replies to "this" thread. You will receive response notifications for up to one week following the original post. Your email address will not be visible to readers.
Email Address: