So I was thinking (always dangerous on my part), maybe I would take some classes at the local community college on HVAC systems.

HVAC seems to be the most frequently expensive repair (especially since they started with the new refrigerant and build all the parts overseas) we have as landlords.

My questions are:

Has anyone done this?

Was it worth it?

Will those classes take you from zero to hero or do they just skim the surface so you still know nothing at the end of them?

If you are an HVAC specialist, would taking some classes allow me to repair and diagnose HVAC issues?

Is the cost of equipment a significant hurdle?

What equipment would I need and estimate cost?

How hard is it to order HVAC equipment online and install it?

Do they even allow you to order online?

I have heard Goodman has sort of generic parts that are easier to find and replace and that Trane has proprietary parts that are harder to find.

Any other advice or suggestions? Books? Videos? Websites?

I've also considered whether I might take some classes.

Other than RE investor I am a mechanic and have been my whole life. When I got my A&P (airframe and powerplant license Freon was in use on airplanes. So we have to be trained in its use. We didn't have the regulations then that we have now.

HVAC work-- can be life threatening. Yes that's right life threatening. When you get hit with stray 120V you get a sting if your lucky. You get hit with 240V -- especially when working with the amps of a compressor-- your history.

DO YOU FEEL COMFORTABLE working on that equipment knowing this?

I've taken the classes your talking about. I needed them to set up accounts for buying equipment in a company name. The largest expense of HVAC contractors is the warranty. We take that out of our guys hands. We supply all equipment they need. He gives a list- we deliver what he needs.

Owners should know the basics of HVAC. Contact your local supply house and ask if they have training they offer for apartment maintenance people. Our local appliance parts place FOX Appliance offers classes. Take the EPA class so you can at least know about Freon and the requirements.

We have all the tools for working on HVAC and have swapped out compressors and parts. When it comes to the WHOLE unit we let a pro-- licensed-- do it. There's just to much liability to have my MM do it or myself.

If you all really knew how cheap-- in comparison to what the HVAC companies charge you-- you would come out of your chair. I just had a drop ship of a 2.5 ton condensing unit and a 3T A-coil. 650 and 300. I have my own Freon 410 and have about 5 bottles of F-22 left. All systems get 410A now. My install guy, who I've known since he was 14 does flat rate for me 500.00. That includes running a new line set. Need new lines due to new spec's on new units.

All of our 63 places have Goodman outside and inside units. We have standard supplies that fix them.

If you have no concept of the 240V damage that can be done-- DON'T DO IT. DO watch some or go to some glasses. Otherwise let a pro do it.

DJ VA 100%. you should have basic knowledge or YOU WILL get ripped off. These HVAC guys think since we all don't have any idea what their doing they can free charge anything they want.

Example: I carry maybe 4 or 5 type capacitors on my maintenance van-- just for my places. Swap them when they go out.

WHAT does the HVAC guy do-- he tells you he doesn't have what you need and takes a 3 hour break going to the local supply house and sits drinking coffee and the hours and hours run up the bill.

Over 25 years community, technical, correctional, and industry professor, trainer, and program coordinator. Over 3000+ students taught.

Master HVAC contractor, RE investor and landlord.

I consult several large hvac companies and I am a certified EPA section 609 proctor and instructor.

Just like the life of an hvac system, your education and skill level will depend on who is installing it and your learning level.

There are companies and techs that will rip you off, there are ALSO good, honest companies and techs that will help you in YOUR RE business.

HVAC is going through another HUGE change especially in the refrigerant world. This happened in the early 90's with R-12 to R-134a

It happened in the 2000's with the phasing out of R-22 to R-410a

The industry is switching over to liquified petroleum based refrigerant (yes, they can explode now) That's another post all together.

I will be speaking at the Mr. Landlord convention on this very topic along with how to put down your tools and HIRE good, honest contractors to do what they are good at so WE can do what WE are good at. Making Freedom!!!

Any trade can be dangerous (I have the scars to prove it) but any education is valuable.

I look forward to helping as many landlords at Mr. Landlord Convention put the tools down. NOW is the time!

I'll agree with Ken on this one. I'm better at finding and making deals than at fixing a/c units.

Just to make a few things clear: most of my places are older mobile homes and are "C" units. Plus, I'm in northern lower Michigan, so the heat of summer is not as intense as many other places. Here, I don't do central a/c units or heaters anymore. If a place has one, I leave it until it breaks,then throw it away. I just make a closet out of the space it formerly occupied. For a/c replacement, I tell tenants to get window units from Wal-Mart or some big box store for about $130 a unit.Then the unit is theirs and they can take it with them when they leave. These last a long time because here it's really only hot about 2 or 3 weeks a year.

For heaters, I get the small white 2ftx2ft wall mounted ones from big box hardware stores for about $225 each. Maybe 3 per house plus the cost of gas line rerouting by a pro. Maybe $800-$900 per house. These are individually controlled, so tenants don't need to have an all or nothing situation, plus it gives 2 backups in case one goes out. Again, it's not an all or nothing like a central unit. I keep several extras in storage so if one goes out, I can deliver a replacement inside of a few hours.Plus, I have a few of the oil filled electric heaters (about $50 each new) just in case.

Comparing prices, I've found this works best for me with what I do and have. My units are "C" units, not A or B, so the tenants don't have the demand for central heat and air that higher level units have. (It's interesting though how people have gotten spoiled. A hundred years ago, AC was not even invented yet and people often used fireplaces or pot belly stoves for heat.(My family used these when I was a teenager.) Then the central heat and AC manufacturers started their advertising campaigns saying how these central units were not only needed but a necessity of life, and here we are--most everyone wants them and even demands them.How soft we have become.

Knowledge doesn’t hurt, if you can get it at the local college, have at it.

I think you can get the knowledge to help your operation more effectively by another method.

First, understand that 90% of AC failures are electrical component failures.

Learn to troubleshoot and test. Do as MYOB does and keep capacitors on hand.

Understand the different types of coolants and their costs. You don’t want to spend $400 in coolant on a 10 year old unit.

Understand that new units will not have as long a useful life as older units. 5 year old + units don’t warrant much repair, replace.

I am interested in learning more about this trade. I have the basics down most times. Have an electrical background from the last few places I worked at.

Planned to take classes when the W2 shut down but never followed thru.

In the past I know I have been screwed over by HVAC places. One guy I was using for a couple years kept saying I needed to replace every single thing he worked on. I was stuck with tenants in need so I did it.

Not any more.

I have safe space heaters in case I need them. I no longer think that no AC is an emergency needing to pay weekend calls for. Was an idiot a few years back and sold all the 5k window units I had because I wanted the space. I will regret that for a very long time.

Since I am still the mom and pop guy and I do any of my own maintenance that I can I think that following thru with the training is a wise choice.

Bonanza I say go for it!

I was registered for an HVAC course this past semester and dropped at the last minute due to covid concerns. I wasn't looking to become a technician, just learn enough to diagnose and troubleshoot minor issues. Also I wanted to know enough to avoid getting ripped off.

I have taken CC classes in Electrical and Plumbing. Both have saved me tons of money by either me doing some troubleshooting and minor repairs myself or being able to speak the jargon with the professional repair folks.

Classes in anything are good. What you learn, retain and get comfortable with doing is entirely up to you.

The electrical danger exists on many levels, learn how to contain that and you will be able to troubleshoot this and many other systems. The sealed system uses several expensive tools to display performance levels and another load of equipment for performing service, r-22 is obsolete but like R-12 and ammonia which was used before that there are substitute and besides a filter dryer change you can keep them in operation as long as the other components are strong enough.

I've been HVAC certified for decades. Here are the facts, as I see them:

Well over half of HVAC issues are electrical, NOT refrigeration related. If you have a basic knowledge of electricity, you can do MOST of the repairs to HVAC.

Probably half the remaining issues are due to dirt. Dirty surfaces cannot transfer heat. That's what HVAC is all about.

Yes, you need a bunch of expensive tools, licensing, and certifications for the refrigeration part.

I should have done that years back considering the amount of units we have....looking back. Oh well mat some good dependable trades people and I really don't do any of my work anymore other maybe cut a yard.

I should have done that years back considering the amount of units we have....looking back. Oh well mat some good dependable trades people and I really don't do any of my work anymore other maybe cut a yard.

I should have done that years back considering the amount of units we have....looking back. Oh well mat some good dependable trades people and I really don't do any of my work anymore other maybe cut a yard.