For gym class in cyber school today, my daughter had to throw an empty grocery bag up in the air and catch it.

Yeah....

We skipped that part.

I thought you and your wife already homeschooled, NE?

I think for my kids, when they had to do virtual learning earlier in the year, the gym teacher would post a weekly activity video link. I don't think we really used them. I just sent my kids outside for fresh air and sunshine.

We are running 2 curriculums: homeschool and public cyber. My wife thought things may return to normal at the school. I laughed and said get ready to withdraw. We had our homeschooling program running so the transition would be smooth when the first school semester ended. I agreed to one semester of cyber. With the homeschool program we're done by 9:30-10 am. Cyber DRAGS until 1-2pm. That's with an 8:30 start.

Both of us are home with them.

I agree WMH and my kids are go, go, go outside all the time.

Also, this isn't really about were we're headed as a family and more about where we as people are headed.

Some of this cyber stuff is awful.

Mike A, my wife is on the PTO and we also watch all the school board meetings online. There is a tremendous buzz in the feedback from parents about students who have been straight A's for all of their schooling who are now C's D's and F's. Many are very stressed about the drop in grades and effects it will have on scholarships and college admissions, both parents and students. I don't know what they are going to do.

It is a complete mess.

On the flip side of the coin is that it is very easy to push play on the lesson and walk away until it is finished and then push play on the next lesson. So I would imagine many older kids whose parents aren't home have quickly found ways to get around doing anything with cyber until its gets to the section where you have to upload the assignment. Then I'm sure they all text each other the answers.

Which, I'm not entirely against, because that's how the real world work with info, but to balance that out and fit it into the cyber programs, it is ripe for cheating the system.

FYI- throwing scarves and catching them, starting with just one scarf, is the beginnings of teaching juggling. Why can juggling be important? Teaches coordination, balance, timing. As a kid, I would have benefitted, as I had very little coordination. ( great balance, great speed.)

Juggling scarves is used in vision therapy to improve peripheral vision, a tremendous thing to have if one wants to be a good driver as an adult. Juggling scarves also improves reading. ( anything which improves vision skills might be improving reading..trust me on this. My kid did years of vision therapy as his vision ‘wasn’t integrated’. Ie his eyes hadn’t learned to work as a team... we did all kinds of weird exercises every night, with weekly session at the therapists.... well worth it, kid is extremely smart, high paid job in high tech field now. )

Obviously, kids at home might not have scarves. But everybody has a grocery bag....and, not all kids are deficient in coordination, peripheral vision, or reading. But, if gym class can improve those things in a fun way.... very valuable for those who need it. Those who don’t need to gain abilities in vision, coordination, might need to gain abilities in doing things that seam silly, because the future boss , the future customer, or even the future spouse wants those things done. ....

Just sayin’

JAC, I don’t think you are a helpful person.

I am appalled daily at my grandchildren's schooling. Oldest is smart as a whip and wants to be a doctor. This year has been terrible for what used to be an incredibly driven teenager.

Second oldest is a huge school slacker athlete who skates by on the edge because he doesn't want to be benched. He admits to cheating and doing minimal work.

The others are all in between. I think it's terrible. I won't say out loud what I think of the governor of Pennsylvania.

Online school is hard on the teachers as well. They can't see who is having difficulty and intervene like they want. It isn't as interactive with kids learning from each other.

Younger children need to be in school they need to be with other kids and their teacher. I think the generation in elementary grades now is going to suffer greatly from this.

Oh, and school has always needed to do a better job of explains to parents why some of the ‘enrichment’ classes benefit core learning.

How long does it take Gym teacher to say, ‘Parents, This activity improves coordination, peripheral vision, vision integration, skills needed for reading and driving’ ....?

Scrub scrub JAC.

Linda J, the kids aren't getting the interaction in the traditional in the school setting. They are basically in bubbles. Our superintendent is discussing literal 3 sided plexiglass portable shields for them to carry from class to class and desk to desk with them through the day.

NE, there are very good homeschooling groups out there, if you are so inclined. They get kids together for classes like gym, art, science. And, 4-H is a most excellent program to supplement ANY type of schooling. Though, my grandkids club is doing virtual stuff now as well. Zoom club meetings and demonstrations.

The plexiglass barriers- ugh!

JAC, public school needs NE’s property taxes. They should send him a thank you note for his above average contributions. Also, at least in my area, private schools saw an opportunity to grow their enrollment by staying open rather than following the public schools (& teacher’s unions) lead and shutting down.

Yes J, the group sessions are a joke for the younger kids, I couldn't imagine the high school students.

Taught for 33 years, High school, Middle school, Adult school, integrated preschool in the high school. Did 'independent learning' with the dropout recovery team. Everything was packets, on-line tests that were keyed to our textbooks and graded by the computer program. Everything was geared for the kids to do alone or with parent's help. Meetings with me, once a week for 1/2 hour to orally go over what they should have learned to be sure they DID. (paperwork can be easily cheated as can computer tests). Most schools don't have programs in place like we had so it's all new to everyone now. Not an ideal situation for 'distance learning' except for limited times for some students. There are no good answers right now, but as a retired teacher, I am all for 'normal' classroom education for most kids. Pandemic is really making life difficult! It's amazing how many parents are coming to me to thank me and ask advice. They realize how hard it is to have to know everything about everything and explain it to their kids.

Bill,

Dang - your daughter has a paper bag!

My kids are going 2 days in person, 3 virtual. That's the most we're allowed to do now, but they're supposed to be opening up to 4 days in person in 2 more weeks.

Some students are 5 days-per-week virtual and will stay that way.

Today, both of my sons are already done with their work and have a jump start on tomorrow's. It was 12:30 PM when they let me know they had everything done. They are both straight A students in advanced placed classes, so nothing to slouch at here. Taking Geometry and Chemistry in 8th grade for H.S. credit. But there's only so much "here's a packet, go do this" you can give out. Teachers are busy Monday and Tuesday teaching the kids who are in their class, so the virtual students get no face time at all.

If that's the acceptable level to which we've sunk in Education, I say pull the plug on public schools and let kids learn on YouTube and/or other online opportunities like "The Great Courses". Why do we need to pay a district full of semi-okay to good math teachers to teach what one world-class teacher can teach via a video lesson? Sure, have a handful of tutors available for call in as needed in case something in the video doesn't make sense or doesn't "click" with a student's learning style, but otherwise I think public schools have showed there is little value in face-to-face, in-person learning.

Too, students are some of the lowest risk people not only to CATCH the disease and to have any symptoms, but also they are finding out they have the lowest odds to TRANSMIT the disease to someone else. Ergo, closing schools isn't the solution, but as C-19 has showed us, perhaps they aren't as necessary as we've been lead to believe in the first place.

...I can't think of a more equitable, economical, and just solution to level the education playing field...

except that kids need the structure and person to person involvement - with teachers, other student, the janitor, the bus driver, etc. No, schools are not to replace the basics of morals and responsibility that parents should but it's all tied together ... kids need to be in school and I can't understand why educators with their degrees that don't see that.

As I read the post I see a silver lining. This pandemic or whatever you want to call it may finally shed some very bright light on the issues in public schools.

We may even move to a point that the tax money for schools follows the student - be it public, private, faith based, home school what ever the parent decides.

NE,

Teach those coop kids some handyman skills - basic wiring, plumbing, hammer/nail, screwgun...

Build some birdhouses, tool boxes, kids LOVE it!

Incorporates real world math, geometry, physics, teamwork, motor skills...

Did I misread that? It looks like you said that your homeschooling starts at 8:30am and is often done by 9:30am or maybe 10am? So, 1 to 1.5 hours of school? Does that actually meet whatever your state requirements are? Or do they not have them for homeschooling there?

Also, unrelated to that (I am not saying the following applies to you at all -- I was just curious about the above and the following is unrelated)...

I'm not anti-homeschooling when it is done right -- which needs to include lots of interaction with other kids.

Unfortunately, I know of several homeschooled kids here that I've worked with some in Scouts. Their parents are helicopter parents and the kid is VERY poorly prepared to work with others. They have been overly sheltered and do not know how to properly interact with others. And their parents are constantly blaming everything on everyone else. So, my experiences with homeschooled kids has, so far, not been a great one.

Some parents are not cut out to "teach" and just have trouble letting their kids go. Those who homeschool for this reason are a real detriment to their children, IMO.

- John...

John, you wife has a masters degree in education and bachelors in business management. I also had tons of management classes in college. We're definitely art helicopter parents and push them in a group setting as much as possible. We just felt that the current public school group setting was not sufficient for our kids and most likely very negative at this time.

We're not concerned with them ending up being sheltered and that's definitely what we don't want. I do know the type of kid that you are referring to also. There is one in our co-op who is like a 10-year-old baby. Not much we can do in that situation.

As far as credit for school, we are able to count other activities as school beyond just bookwork.

Co-op counts, analyzing a rental house counts, a nature hike counts, working on the truck counts, it's all in how we document it.

Still not helpful, JAC.

My daughter took a ‘sampler’ class when she transitioned to public school in sixth grade. Art, music, family and consumer ed ( face), and shop class. In family and consumer education, the kids were supposed to make a pillowcase. Ha! My daughter already had already seen many garments by this time, so the teacher brought in her own serger for my daughter to learn how to sew on a new machine. And, the smart teacher let my shy daughter help other kids with their simple pillow cases.

Folding clothes and cooking a simple meal from a recipe teaches quite a bit of math. As does sewing. Fractions, geometry, spatial reasoning.

Jac, it's not the public school systems job to push political leanings in a certain direction either, yet they still find time to do that.

JAC some of your conclusions are a little out there. "This is why you and people like you are broke."

I don't think NE, a long-time RE investor, is broke. And while I may well disagree whole-heartedly with him on some things (specifically mask-wearing and the virus virulence) you are not supposed to get personal about it. "...people like you..." what does that mean anyway?

Done right, home-schooling often provides a more well-rounded, helpful education than our broken public schools, especially in times of Covid. Many teachers have no idea how to teach virtually (not their fault, they were never taught.)

I'm all for schools teaching practical life skills. It has been a real disservice that this has been pushed out of school curriculums. You can see the lack of this in tenants of all economic persuasions. I suspect that the lack is even more apparent in certain cities (NYC, Portland, LA).

What JAC and others have been discussing is what used to be called "home economics'. Apparently, it has been taught in US schools since the early 19th century.

See en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Home_economics.

Some interesting points from the article:

- "Home economics courses often consist of learning how to cook, how to do taxes, and how to perform child care tasks." (Maybe NE can teach the kids about taxes.)

- The teaching of home economics greatly increased in the U.S. when President Lincoln signed the Morrill Act in 1862.

- In the early 20th century, "American families began to consume many more goods and services than they produced. To guide women in this transition, professional home economics had two major goals: to teach women to assume their new roles as modern consumers and to communicate homemakers’ needs to manufacturers and political leaders."

This whole article makes for some interesting reading. I suspect NE could come up with some great topics for classes from this article.