Constant Misunderstanding (by Jeff [CO]) Oct 13, 2020 4:12 PM|
Constant Misunderstanding (by WMH [NC]) Oct 13, 2020 4:16 PM
Constant Misunderstanding (by David [MI]) Oct 13, 2020 4:29 PM
Constant Misunderstanding (by LisaFL [FL]) Oct 13, 2020 10:09 PM
Constant Misunderstanding (by Johnny B. [MA]) Oct 14, 2020 1:44 AM
Constant Misunderstanding (by Jeff [CO]) Oct 14, 2020 8:27 AM
Constant Misunderstanding (by S i d [MO]) Oct 14, 2020 8:48 AM
Constant Misunderstanding (by nhsailmaker [NH]) Oct 14, 2020 9:22 AM
Constant Misunderstanding (by Jeff [CO]) Oct 14, 2020 10:35 AM
Constant Misunderstanding (by Mike45 [NV]) Oct 14, 2020 3:34 PM
Constant Misunderstanding (by Vee [OH]) Oct 14, 2020 6:19 PM
Constant Misunderstanding (by 6x6 [TN]) Oct 14, 2020 7:01 PM
Constant Misunderstanding (by Jeff [CO]) Oct 14, 2020 10:53 PM
Constant Misunderstanding (by Robin [WI]) Oct 14, 2020 11:15 PM
Constant Misunderstanding (by 6x6 [TN]) Oct 15, 2020 9:47 AM
Constant Misunderstanding (by 6x6 [TN]) Oct 15, 2020 10:24 AM
Constant Misunderstanding (by Wilma [PA]) Oct 15, 2020 1:50 PM
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Constant Misunderstanding (by Jeff [CO]) Posted on: Oct 13, 2020 4:12 PM
This keeps coming up. Today's example:
"Hi. I know it's the 13th, but my lease expires at the end of the month." I will be out then. Are you okay with my just paying October's rent?" (She had paid it on the 1st).
Me: I'm sorry, but you just gave me notice for the end of November.
She was mad at me for that, even though I explained that notice must be given in accordance with the rental period. She asked if she could make her notice effective for November 13th.
"No, ma'am. Your lease runs from the first day of the month through the last."
It seems to be very hard for tenants to understand this simple concept. It is explained at lease signings.
30-day notice must be given by the start of the next rental period.
She then said that I need the money more than she does, so she'll just pay it!
I'm the bad guy.
Constant Misunderstanding (by WMH [NC]) Posted on: Oct 13, 2020 4:16 PM
I think pro-rating rent fosters this belief. It's common. I've done it. I hate doing it, but I've done it. I need to stop doing it.
If we pro-rate on the way in, "obviously" we would pro-rate on the way out. --50.82.xxx.xxx
Constant Misunderstanding (by David [MI]) Posted on: Oct 13, 2020 4:29 PM
I only do yearly renewals, no m2m. So when a tenant asks to stay for an extra month or two , most of the time I will say no . I brace myself when they finally move-out, because I know what is coming after they've moved out in a hurry. Trash , furniture, food in fridge, etc.
But if a tenant wants to move out early, I try to accommodate whenever possible by ending their lease early with no penalty. I do not want the property sitting empty while they drag their feet moving their stuff out because they know they would be paying for it.
Now, if they give me really short notice , or they want to move out in the winter, I say no and ask for ELT. --50.4.xxx.x
Constant Misunderstanding (by LisaFL [FL]) Posted on: Oct 13, 2020 10:09 PM
It is common. Was this a month to month or the end of a one year term? I always send a notice explaining in detail how giving notice works well in advance of the end of the lease or any time there is an increase for a month to month tenant.
I also state in the lease that last month’s rent is not prorated. This has helped but I still get those who play dumb. Like “I gave you notice on the 15th of September so do I only owe for two weeks in October because it is 30 days?”
And then I explain, no, giving me notice on 16 September means October is your last month and if you look at your last renewal notice or the lease you will see that last month’s rent must be paid in full regardless of what day you actually move out. This is because you pay by the month not by the day, that would be a hotel.
Usually then I get, “Well didn’t I pay last month’s rent when I moved in?”
I have never collected last month’s rent from anyone I tell them and refer them back to their lease. Then I get an “OK, thanks.”
Still irritating but doesn’t happen much anymore and usually only happens with the PITA tenants of which I have few. Thankfully.
Reminding them of how it works at every opportunity is helpful. --75.89.xxx.xxx
Constant Misunderstanding (by Johnny B. [MA]) Posted on: Oct 14, 2020 1:44 AM
I have an example in my rental agreement to clearly demonstrate this situation. Tenants don’t seem to get it otherwise. --24.147.xx.xxx
Constant Misunderstanding (by Jeff [CO]) Posted on: Oct 14, 2020 8:27 AM
I love how the tenant tried to make me look like the bad guy. She failed. Her lease expires at the end of this month. This is from my leases:
"At the expiration of the period of Lease, if TENANT shall continue to occupy the premises, they shall do so on a month-to month basis subject to all other terms and conditions of this Lease.
Landlord may then terminate the tenancy or modify the terms of this Agreement by giving the TENANT one month written notice per the rental period (first day of the month through the last day). TENANT may also terminate the tenancy by giving the Landlord one month written notice one month before the lease expires or any time after (per the rental period)." --76.120.xx.xxx
Constant Misunderstanding (by S i d [MO]) Posted on: Oct 14, 2020 8:48 AM
I think you're using the incorrect terminology to describe what is going on in this situation. Misunderstandings occur when communication is unclear. There is no misunderstanding here.
The problem here is she doesn't WANT your words to be true. She is living in denial because it doesn't agree with her plans. You can explain until you are blue in the face. You can show her the lease she signed. It will not matter. She WANTS to be out in 30 days and not owe the rest, so that is the only answer she will accept.
Probably what happened is she forgot to give notice on time, realized she forgot, and so she's trying to dump her lack of responsibility into your lap. For that to make sense to her, she has to make it your fault.
People talk themselves into their own version of reality all the time. This is why some people believe politicians in Washington DC can fix their lives: they WANT it to be true! Thus relieving themselves of their personal responsibility.
I don't argue. I present the facts one time, and if they resist I email them the highlighted lease clause, and from that point on it's up to them to live up to the terms or not. If they move out early, it's no skin off my teeth as long as they paid up in full. If they fail to pay thru the end date of their lease, I will evict them. Why bother? Because they aren't following the lease as promised. There is no reason to suspect they will move out as promised either. So I take steps to make sure they are out. --107.216.xxx.xxx
Constant Misunderstanding (by nhsailmaker [NH]) Posted on: Oct 14, 2020 9:22 AM
Landlording is rarely a REPEAT business
Ya can't fix stupid --24.62.xxx.xxx
Constant Misunderstanding (by Jeff [CO]) Posted on: Oct 14, 2020 10:35 AM
S i d, you're right. She saw me as a nice guy landlord who takes care of his tenants and buildings to the nth degree. She figured that I would be like, "Sure, no problem. I understand. We're good!" She mistook my niceness for weakness.
I don't argue with tenants. I send them pastes from leases and let them work with that.
We had a good relationship until this. I have zero regrets, though. This is on her 100%. --76.120.xx.xxx
Constant Misunderstanding (by Mike45 [NV]) Posted on: Oct 14, 2020 3:34 PM
I do not know how your lease is worded, but to me, a 30 day notice can be given any day of the month, and a tenant can terminate a MTM tenancy on any day 30 days or more after the notice was given. If a Tenant gives me notice today, he can pay me through November 13 and we are good. --76.4.xxx.xxx
Constant Misunderstanding (by Vee [OH]) Posted on: Oct 14, 2020 6:19 PM
You may want to remind her if the place is left sparkly clean you would return the unused rent portion, that is how they know to squeeze their own turnips. --76.188.xxx.xxx
Constant Misunderstanding (by 6x6 [TN]) Posted on: Oct 14, 2020 7:01 PM
I see what you and Sid are saying and you may very well be right but, I can also see how she may not have fully understood the lease.
What you shared with us that is part of your lease is pretty clear except for the last part, which just so happens to pertain to her.
"TENANT may also terminate the tenancy by giving the Landlord one month written notice one month before the lease expires or any time after (per the rental period"
Especially this part:
any time after (per the rental period"
I could actually see her not understanding that completely.
I know that may seem strange to you because you are smart but I would probably be a little confused myself as I am not as smart as you either.
Judging from your response to Sid, I am assuming that you communicated via text or email as to not have a long winded conversation or listen to excuses or otherwise but, I wonder if it might have helped her understand better if you had actually spoken to her. I think that sometimes and in certain instances that a more personal interaction is needed as it is hard to get a feeling as to how a person is reacting via a text or email. She may have perceived you as being bitter if you only texted her pastes from the lease.
Constant Misunderstanding (by Jeff [CO]) Posted on: Oct 14, 2020 10:53 PM
6x6, well, I am not that smart. Just persistent. :)
I explain to them at least signings how it works.
The rental period runs from the first of the month through the last day. Notice given DURING the rental period would be effective for the last day of the NEXT rental period.
I will look for ways to make the leases even more clear. I didn't realize that it was confusing.
I doubt she thinks I'm bitter, as I am not. I included my comments as well as lease clauses. --76.120.xx.xxx
Constant Misunderstanding (by Robin [WI]) Posted on: Oct 14, 2020 11:15 PM
Vee uses an analogy that I find helpful:
"You pay for rent one month at a time. You can't rent for 10 days of the month just like you can't drink half of a jug of milk and return the rest to the store."
I also have an example IN THE LEASE that walks them through a hypothetical. That said, if they can move out a couple of days before the end of the month and I have someone lined up to move in on the first, I tell them I'll prorate the extra days back to them. That gives me more time to go through and prepare it for the next tenant. --104.230.xxx.xx
Constant Misunderstanding (by 6x6 [TN]) Posted on: Oct 15, 2020 9:47 AM
Thank you Jeff for clarifying.
It probably is not confusing to most people but, as for myself, I sometimes need more detailed wording or an example, such as Robin mentioned, in order for it to "click" or make since to me. That is why sometimes I ask for someone on here to give an example or more details. I have never been a good book learner but more hands on. --73.120.xx.xxx
Constant Misunderstanding (by 6x6 [TN]) Posted on: Oct 15, 2020 10:24 AM
Another thing, I can actually learn more from this forum then I can from reading a book because I can't ask the book for more details or examples but I can on here.
The reason I mentioned a more personal approach is because on the phone I can ask better questions or in better ways and if I am the one explaining then I can give more details and judging from the sound of there voice or how they respond I can determine better how I might need to explain.
In a text or email and even on this forum, it is sometimes hard to determine how the person is responding or there temperament because you don't actually hear it in there voice. --73.120.xx.xxx
Constant Misunderstanding (by Wilma [PA]) Posted on: Oct 15, 2020 1:50 PM
FWIW, I find that the tenants who ask a lot of clarifying questions about the rental agreement terms before they sign are the ones who give me zero headaches about giving proper notice and following the other agreement requirements. The ones who just say, "Yeah, I understand." are the most likely to be stunned by enforcement of those requirements. --96.227.xxx.xxx
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