I was in an apartment today of a low-income kid on disability. It was one of those odd floor-plan, peeling paint, less than perfect places. However, LL supplied nice AC window units, new hot water, decent kitchen, washer/dryer, stove, fridge. Tenant was paying $325 per month.

If I owned that space I would fix it up, yes, but I'd charge $1000.

This kid cannot afford a dime more than he is paying.

Great Post WMH,...I see this situation in every neighborhood where I have rental properties. There is no easy answer here.

Good topic there WMH.

I'm often conflicted on this as well. My units are class C all the way. I keep the rents in the range that can be afforded by the $8-$15 per hour crowd. I want to provide basic starter type housing, so no roof leaks but not much in the way of amenities. If I put in a/c, stove, refrigerator, washer, dryer I'd have to charge $700-800+ and the $8-$15 per hour people can't afford that(especially after buying their pot, booze and cigs).

This is my adaption to the local situation here. Housing prices here fall into 3 groups: low priced(under 50k), middle price ($70-115K, and expensive (over $135K).

The $8-$15per hour crowd CANNOT get the middle or high priced places and higher earners BUY a house. There are few renters here except short term that pay over $900+ for rent.

To get places to cash flow, especially at that 2% a month level, I have to keep my all in near $25K per unit or less. I can do that by doing the bare bones, no appliances, no frills method. By letting tenants do the frills and their own used appliances, it just works better. There are tons of thrift stores here where they can get used appliances for $50-125 all day.

Sure, some call me a slumlord, but others appreciate that their rent is $500-650 and not $750-950 for the same place.

Good topic there WMH.

I'm often conflicted on this as well. My units are class C all the way. I keep the rents in the range that can be afforded by the $8-$15 per hour crowd. I want to provide basic starter type housing, so no roof leaks but not much in the way of amenities. If I put in a/c, stove, refrigerator, washer, dryer I'd have to charge $700-800+ and the $8-$15 per hour people can't afford that(especially after buying their pot, booze and cigs).

This is my adaption to the local situation here. Housing prices here fall into 3 groups: low priced(under 50k), middle price ($70-115K, and expensive (over $135K).

The $8-$15per hour crowd CANNOT get the middle or high priced places and higher earners BUY a house. There are few renters here except short term that pay over $900+ for rent.

To get places to cash flow, especially at that 2% a month level, I have to keep my all in near $25K per unit or less. I can do that by doing the bare bones, no appliances, no frills method. By letting tenants do the frills and their own used appliances, it just works better. There are tons of thrift stores here where they can get used appliances for $50-125 all day.

Sure, some call me a slumlord, but others appreciate that their rent is $500-650 and not $750-950 for the same place.

Wmh,

If you bought you the place, fixed it up and could get $1,000/month,...then the low-income kid on disability would be living under a bridge. Could you live with that?

I've purchased many run down apartment properties and fixed them up, knowing that it would take me over 10 years to return an income profit.

My last apartment building that I purchased wasn't so bad. Just needed a little TLC. But the City put the Property in REAP (Rent Escrow Program) and called me a slumlord.

You see an electrical permit for an exterior motion sensor light was misplaced and the city sent the notice to the prior owner even though I had registered myself as the new owner with 4 city departments the day after my purchase closed.

This went to two city hearings and they City lied. They had a Tenant Advocacy Group inspect the building and the tenants wanted New Paint, New Flooring, New Blinds -- even though it wasn't necessary. I had to spend thousands to get the property out of REAP.

Then when the nightmare was over, the City recorded a lien no the property even though I paid all requested fee's and the City had stolen part of the rents and a fee for their service to the community.

On that building I wasn't allowed to evict tenants for 1 year, otherwise it would be considered a retaliatory action. I had two tenants abuse this law and it took me 6 months to evict for non -payment of rent.

I used buy buildings as a contractor, fix them up and re-rent them to low income families. But no More. After the City has screwed me over again and again, and when I fight them they act punitive and then inspect 100 units of mine and look for any flaws.

Los Angeles is full of crooks, thieves -- not those in jail but in City Government.

I have roach infested peeling paint dumps all the way up to gorgeous apartments and flip houses with marble, stainless appliances and granite.

A place for everyone.

Things like awkward layout and bad decorating are in the eye of the beholder.

My city is on a big AFFORDABLE HOUSING kick. So they are tearing down homes that could easily be fixed up by investors using their own money, but rather tear it down and build 1 - 2 bedroom apts at a cost of $105,000 each unit. (Apts sell for $30-40k per unit )

Similarly the city is pushing for beautification, demanding I rehab an exterior or they will tear it down. The issue: peeling paint. My cost to comply is $23,000

This does not sound politically correct but each town needs a poor neighborhood -a place for poor people to live.

A few years ago I sold my lowest level house on a few acres of land. Old 2 family farmhouse, looked terrible from the outside, nothing was great on the inside, even let the tenants paint what they wanted, they had dogs, heated mostly with wood stove. I fixed only what was needed. Worked with the tenant to pay weekly. I actually got a decent rent for what they had. I knew I would have a hard time finding another decent tenant, they knew they had it better than other places they could afford. Tenants were there 15 years and 19 years. Since a development was going in they had plenty of time to find another place. I actually had to serve notice to one tenant as the bulldozers were coming!

The real bad guys are the politicians that try to legislate a perfect housing world.

Which any investor with half a brain knows is never going to happen.

If you take money for rent-- no matter the amount-- they should not be living in below stand homes or apts. You can dress it up any way you want-- if you do that your lower then SLUM lord..... We don't care what neighborhood our homes are in they are A PLUS in that neighborhood.

There are more excuses posted here-- blaming others and politicians and laws-- no it's us -- the LL's who allow it.

From all the posts I've seen here almost everyone is local owner-- not mega apt owner. This slum interior or exterior should not be going on in your property's.

Myob, that's not always the case. I have a slum type house that was inherited with slum type tenants and I will ride that wave as long as I can. One unit finally turned and I fixed it to my standards. The other side of that duplex, the inherited tenants are still burrowed in like ticks. Nasty people in a nasty unit paying just under market.

They can stay as long as they want.

If you take money for rent-- no matter the amount-- they should not be living in below stand homes or apts. You can dress it up any way you want-- if you do that your lower then SLUM lord..... We don't care what neighborhood our homes are in they are A PLUS in that neighborhood.

There are more excuses posted here-- blaming others and politicians and laws-- no it's us -- the LL's who allow it.

From all the posts I've seen here almost everyone is local owner-- not mega apt owner. This slum interior or exterior should not be going on in your property's.

Sounds more like the dog ate my home work type excuses.

I only paint between tenants. How long has this low income tenant been in this rental? It doesn't sound like a slum to me with AC, good appliances, hot water, a roof that doesn't leak.

Paint is expensive and I'm going to guess that this tenant wants his low rent more than he wants new paint and a rent increase.

I keep my places nice, but I've never (even 40 years ago) had a place that rented for $325 a month.

LL is already absorbing it. JKJ -- what i'm saying the LL is doing right by this person--but can we get it really right? If you're accepting 325 for this place and have done all that was said-- can we not make it nice inside? Does that make it a 1K rental ? no of course not. We are LL's not Slumlords. You won't believe this but as LL's we should feel good about it.

The tenant has been there for 1.5 years, but who knows how long it's been since the LL was inside? He mentioned that someone in the building works for the LL or has something to do with the LL, didn't really catch it.

The peeling paint was in two rooms, two large sheets, one inside a closet. Maybe it's new. It wasn't peeling everywhere.

Pretty judge mental of another person to say because he/ she/ zee didn’t do that ONE thing YET to say the person is lower than a slumlord. Who knows if WMH were to visit the place again in six months if the peeling paint would still be there, or maybe, just maybe, that landlord would have gotten caught up on getting electric updates, A/C installs, decent kitchens, and all of the other things done that were present in this unit.

As for others who buy a unit with a sketchy/ clouded (forgive my unfamiliarity with title issues,) and an even sketchier tenant in place, leaving the unit just be until such time as the title has been cleared, and the tenant has decided to move up or down in life, isn’t such a bad thing. I didn’t use to see it this way; used to think, ‘Oh, at least do this or that... ‘ but after reading about landlords getting frustrated with tenants who live like ( fill in the blank,) and dealing personally with people with hoarding and other mental health disorders, sometimes leaving a person be, for now, is the best practice. With my first-ever house, I was going to come in and touch up any paint chips from the tenant moving in, as the corners were tight to get furniture into the bedrooms. She really balked at that, I wondered why, but, being inexperienced, decided to wait a bit. Turns out, she knew her adult son with a brain injury would eventually be couch-surfing, and he was prone to outbursts. She really was looking for a landlord who would not fuss over a little chipped paint. ( thick plaster walls, he never punched a hole in the walls, but did get hand x-rayed the one time he tried....walls 1, bad-temper 0) I finally gave them the boot when things escalated. And she has since moved several times ( great garnishable wages) most likely over same issue. Now, was this guy just a jerk, or, did the traumatic brain injury that hospitalized him for months leave him a permanent house-beater? Is there a place for him? Or, does he become like the guy moving his car up and down the street by one of my rentals, sleeping in the car at night, being allowed in the families home during the hot days? Does he become like Dontre Hamilton, sleeping on park benches in Red Arrow Park, Starbucks employees calling cops on him all the time because he scares off their customers? Sad, sad, no win for anyone situation, that one.

Ken i would say normally your are correct- but this person has issues and the LL knows them and actually accepted the person.

My point is; our properties need to be the best we can make them no matter what we make $ on them. Can't say "OH this is OK" or that because I'm not making top dollar on the unit.

Okay I am responding without reading the other post first so as not to change my thoughts right now. I don't think either LL is necessarily a bad guy. It sounds like this LL is providing a decent, just not pretty, place. I think if the tenant is happy to have the place at such a low rent then whats wrong with it as long as the LL keeps it safe and functional. When I first read your post I thought, WOW that is cheep, if the LL approved and I was able I would offer to paint the space over time if I was worried about it. Americans are spoiled and get caught up in cosmetics instead of needs. On the other hand if you want more rent and want a nice looking place and so does the tenant and they are willing to pay more for a nice place then what is wrong with that. This LL may have less worry then we do and he is providing a place for the less fortunate(had to look up the spelling on that word,LOL)who may be on the street otherwise.

I bought a little house for $6000. Tenant (hoarder) was only paying $290/mo when I bought it. Tenant told me he couldn't afford any more rent. I believed him. Told him if he didn't need me to fix anything for him, he could keep paying the same rate...but if I put it on our regular maintenance plan, I would need to get near market rate. He understood.

That was 10 years ago. I've not been in the place since I bought it.

He pays $290/mo like clockwork, ahead of time.

Can’t remember who once wrote on this site that there are no slumlords only slum tenants.

Beth WI. Felons? Maybe depending on crime. Fired from job? Maybe depends how long they've been on the new job. Job security is number one. Evicted? Yes and I have. Mental? No. Don't know who's job it may be-- but it's not my job.

I've talked about this a lot recently. I rent Class C units, and my standard is "clean, safe, and functional."

Hello avocado green fridge. Good morning 40-year old cabinets. Howdy do, galvanized plumbing.

If it works, I keep it.

My rents are now on the aggressive side for low-end units, because costs are going up. I got his with property tax increases for all units this year. My handyman raised his rates now too. $35/hour up from $25. Costs are rising.

If I redid my kitchens and baths every 10-15 years for a cost of $8,000 - $10,000, I would not get any nearly enough extra rent to justify the pay back. These folks are okay with having a roof that doesn't leak, light sockets that work, plumbing that doesn't back up, and hot water.

So I do not consider myself a slum lord. But I understand the role slummers play. There are 3 notorious slummers in my town. One of them is getting shut down now, after 20+ years of his activity. The result? TONS of applications from poorly qualified applicants every time I have a vacancy...more than usual. These are the folks he'd rent to because they could show up with a fistful of cash. Where will they go now? I dunno. I'm not letting them in my places. Maybe they'll squat somewhere. Maybe they'll crash on someone's couch. Maybe they'll be homeless.

When you consider our history, as little as 100 years ago the majority of houses in rural areas had dirt floors, an outhouse, hand drawn water from a well, and all water was heated on a wood fired stove. These properties are "slums" by modern standards. The average dump owned by our 3 slummers is in better condition.

Née, you are housing someone with a serious mental illness, keeping them off the streets, and out of a worse situation. Yes, you also fit what I have heard as the classic definition of slumlord: someone who buys houses, doesn’t invest in fixing them up, gets what he can for them. BUT, looking at it from another perspective, this individual is able to live how they see fit, no one is forcing them out because of their illness. He’s not sleeping under a park bench somewhere, so, as long as it’s not causing a problem for neighbors (vermin, very unsightly outside,) a case can be made for leave well enough alone.... no easy answer....