I think it is safe to assume that many of the LL's here are the "Do It Yourself" types. Even when you can afford to hire something out, you may still choose to go the DIY route,...why is this?

Not saying it's smart...but here's some reasons:

Speed. (If I want it painted TODAY, and I have time TODAY, I can get it painted TODAY).

Odd jobs. (Some jobs are just hard to hire. .ie get an old desk out of the basement and haul it to the dump and clean the gutters out) (Yes, most of these can be handled by your regular handyman)

WHY? Because since I was pre teen I could fix anything and learn anything mechanical. Needs: 1 screw driver, 1 hammer and 1 pair of plier's.

Thanks Ned,...where are you? I thought I was the only AL poster here,...LOL. I'm in Gadsden.

How 'smart' it is to do it yourself would be the subject of another posting. For the time being, I just want to know YOUR personal reasons for taking the DIY route.

I hire out most roofing, major electrical, and major hvac.

I do most everything else myself. If I hire someone to help with other repairs, I find I spend a lot of time supervising their work and then redoing what they have done.

I will occasionally use a tenant's kids to help clean and paint, but, I am usually not satisfied with their work and work ethic.

I enjoy doing the work myself. I like the challenge of repairing things myself. As someone said, I cannot break it any worse than it is already broken.

If I continue to add property, I will need to hire more work out.

MYOB,

HI Roy,

Maybe I can shed a little light on this one.

A lot of the landlords I've met who do a lot of their own repairs themselves seem to have either come from a construction background or from a family that had rentals when they were young (8-18 years old). By either helping parents or by being in the handyman/construction business, they picked up the skills and learned the costs and made connections in the business.

Therefore, when they know what needs to be done, its often easier for them to just DIY. Cheaper too.

As we get more units and older, we tend to use more of the handymen.

It's a personal choice. At some point, the cash flow is large enough to just hire it out if we want to do this. Some of us just like doing the work. For some of us, its age or health. For some, there are so many deals to be had that it's far more sensible to spend time putting deals together.

For some of us, we don't have a strong construction background. We are good at other things. So those of us in this category are much more likely to hire things done.

One trouble spot I often see is where someone without a strong construction background gets into fixer uppers, especially fixers needing major work when they do not have enough cash and connections in the trades. This leads to them paying absolute top dollar for repairs as well as everything taking much longer. Much like someone who is not a mechanic or auto body person thinking they will buy an old classic car that needs a lot of work and fix it up in a couple weeks for cheap.

Roy I still work-- but it's interrupted each day with 2 hrs of racquetball with my buddies.

When I want to hire any job out,...my town offers me 2 Options.

Option #1: I can hire licensed pros (ones with a business license and liability insurance) and I will have to pay a professional price (min. of $60.00/hr.) for their services. I only do this for jobs that require permits. In my town, a permit is required to install a new electric water heater.

Option #2: Hire the 'jack of all trades and master at none types'. This is mixed bag here. Some are really good, some are mediocre and some are downright pathetic.

Richard - I know what you mean. I did not have a construction background when I first started with Fixers in 2006. I got ripped off several times too.

Roy youtube!

Roy new electric water heater--??? If there's one there already its not new-- your replacing existing. PERMITS? Really?

Cheaper, quicker, easier.

I purchased my first rental at age 18. By 20 I owned 5 single family homes. I worked full time and went to college. In those days I had the best manager and handyman that money could buy. They were part of my team. Real estate was fun, easy and profitable.

In time all good things must end. My manager/realtor went from being a sales associate to a broker. She started her own business and her fee's went up. Her handyman got licensed and as a contractor his prices almost doubled.

The tax lawns on real estate changed the depreciation schedule from 15 years to 29 years and the market also took a dive. Now out of college and needing to cut costs, I felt that I could do better myself. Also my broker/manager didn't handle multi-family rentals, only single family homes.

With the City, County, State and Federal Government making new laws to chip away at landlords profits, I needed to be more hands on.

The tradesman I found in those days did such average quality work or charged "Beverly Hills" prices, I got licensed and kept on doing things my way. The right way. I could see how improvements to a rental would increase it's desirability, a better tenant pool and increase rent.

In short I could buy older units with defects and turn the ugly duck into a beautiful swan. A 2 bedroom 1 bathroom unit with 1 parking spot into a 2 bedroom 2 bathroom deluxe unit with 2 parking spots, hardwood floors, modern kitchen with upgraded plumbing and electrical -- now all within my budget.

I hope this answers your question.

MYOB,

Roy FREE IS NOT ALWAYS FREE!

WHAT YOU DID WAS A CHANGE not a swap out that's why it needed permit?

NE,

MYOB,

Roy, when that time comes, I'll have enough flips going to justify paying the costs for repairs on rentals.

Hands off repairs are cost prohibitive for having EVERYTHING hired out.

The cashflow and math doesn't work. It just doesn't. Not for me at the point I'm at with my business.

Cost is the biggest reason I do it myself. The second reason is I still enjoy it. I hire out the stuff I don't want to do. This is usually plumbing and electrical. There are a few things I don't know how, so those are hired out as well.

I'm self taught. Before YouTube was around, I just wasn't afraid to tackle the jobs. I asked questions where it didn't make sense and went for it. Mistakes were made of course, but it was done. Now, I'm old enough that I don't have the desire to learn the stuff I don't know (flooring). Although installers say it's easy, I just don't want to. Some of the stuff I do know, I don't have the desire to do anymore (roofing). I did my last roof approx 10 years ago. It's hired done now. Too hard on the body when you don't do that type of work every day.

Roy if you do all rehabs-- are you doing those that don't need new water heaters or just doing them because they're free? As you pointed out you gotta get a permit $, licensed person $(elec) and then someone to kill the gas $. Sounds expensive? I suppose if the gas unit is bad why not change it out to electric? But what do you come ahead of? gas water heater is 350.00.

Natural Gas is cheap? I really don't care that TENANTS prefer electric? When they have gas they say I love electric!! What tenants like is not having gas because gas is a service they've stiffed before and they need to get approved-- that's been our experience. See it on credit reports all the time. Here in GA we have IEI on a continuous service contract that's under lying on every SFH. Not a pain since they pay us 2x's a year a stipend for people that use them or continue to stay with them. Not much but it's something?

There are a couple of things I hire out if they are complicated. I call for HVAC, anything electrical beyond the easy basics, roofing and painting because I hate to paint.

My experience with a lot of repairs are that I do a much better job. It's also difficult to find good repairmen who know what they are doing and don't try to cheat me.

I started DIY because I could not afford to hire someone. Simple things like changing light fixtures, building shelves, painting etc. (had to go to the library to look things up, not You-tube back then!) I enjoyed doing it. So does my husband (for our house, not so much rentals) Once we had some money and hired a few things out, we were disappointed in the job done for the high price. We could misalign the boards, but would not let ourselves, not going to pay someone to do that. Then we tried to hire out a few jobs and getting a contractor to even come and give a price was way too much work. So we DIY.

So we still enjoy doing the stuff, still save money, do it at our time frame, to out specification. In fact, working on daughters house project this weekend!

When I was first starting out it was the only option I had. No extra money to hire anyone.

I not knocking anyone here who chooses to DIY. My reasons for hiring stuff out is this:

Electrical - I can do the small stuff like changing out electrical outlets and installing ceiling fans, but the big stuff that deals with installing breaker boxes and re-wiring,..I call the pros in. Several of my rental houses have had to be re-wired just because some idiot DIY (previous owner) made a horrible attempt to do it themselves. Think "open-splices' galore, even behind drywall. My electrician once said, "it is a miracle this house has not had an electrical fire yet". Imagine a clothes dryer attached to the fuse box with a 16 amp extension cord.

Plumbing - Again, I can do the small stuff but when the 50 plus year old underground pipes have busted in several places, it is time to call "the man". My master plumber gives me discounts just because of the amount of work I give him. And at Christmas time, he even sends me a fruit basket. No other contractor does this.

Roofing: at my age, there is a little voice in my head that says,.."don't climb that 25 ft. extension ladder". Everyone here, regardless of your age, should listen to that little voice that is inside your head.

Flooring: I hate any job that requires me to work on my knees which is why I have never installed one plank of Allure flooring,...I hire it out at .50 cents a sq.ft.

HVAC _ I can install window a/c units but that is about it. I do not have the tools or the knowledge to do anything else. I have a great HVAC man and I think he sits by the phone waiting for me to call.

Roy;

In Virginia, The owner is allowed to do any type of repair or addition he wants without any credentials being required. He just has to be the owner of the property. He still must get the permits and the city inspector will make sure all the work is up to code.

In 1988 I bought my first home. I was 26 at the time and the house had aluminum wiring. In 1995 I had tenants in it and wanted to remove the fuse panel and replace it with circuit breakers. I also wanted to replace all the aluminum with copper. I got a book out of the library about circuit panels and residential wiring and read over it in one evening.

The next day I went to the city and got my permit. With the permit, I got the power company to remove the lock on my meter. I pulled my meter and replaced my main (From meter to circuit panel). I also replaced the fuse panel and all wiring to include the Electric Stove and AC System.

When I was finished, I went back to the City Inspector who came out and verified that everything was up to code. He made sure I had two grounding rods installed 5 feet apart. Then he signed off on it.

Him signing off my work was very important to me. It removed any liability of my work as he certified that everything done was up to code. After that first rewire, I learned a lot about electrical and feel comfortable with any type of residential electrical work.

My reason for DIY has changed over the years. At first, it was cost savings. Every dollar I could save was another dollar to invest in more units.

Now, I could afford to hire it out but I find great satisfaction in taking a dump and turning it into something nice. I'm a full timer and if I wasn't doing maintenance and remodels I would be a couch potato and an unhealthy mess. So, I also do it to keep active and in shape. This week I dug out, set forms, and poured a concrete patio by hand. Not easy work, but I got a good workout and sweated off a couple of pounds. I hate going to the gym but don't mind doing this stuff. I have a couple of friends who are still active doing this stuff in their 70's. I don't know when I'll quit, but for now it keeps me active.

Patrick,

You did a complete re-wire and added a breaker box all from just reading a book from the library? And all of your 1st time work here passed inspection? You must be a 'gifted' individual.

Two reasons:

1. Cost savings

2. I enjoy it.

1. Last month I borrowed a backhoe and installed new field lines on a septic system. Cost me $1k and 6 hours. Hiring it out would have cost me $3700.

2. I love being able to see the results of my work. My day job for decades was reading dry environmental law and putting it into practice. Sometimes you could see no progress in YEARS. When I cut grass (with my zero turn mower) I can see the improvement NOW.

I 've always enjoyed puddering .... new problems are a new challenge.

I am cutting stone today and resurfacing a cement (UGLY) chimney. The results are STUNNING. Got the idea from my foreman (his father taught him). Just another skill set in my pocket.

I've never gotten into upgrades and renovations but I do frequently get involved in basic repairs.

I do so because I have checked out the problem and know exactly what needs to be done and how I want to do it.

I have then obtained exactly what I need to do the repair before the handyman gets there. At that point, I have my handyman come over and work with him telling him exactly what I want done and how I want it done, and often doing it myself. He has any tools I might need and I have already picked up whatever parts, supplies, or other materials are needed. If the work requires another set of hands, we've got them. If the work requires tasks I don't want to do, he's there for those.

The bottom line is that I do these things because I don't want to have to have a poor job done over a month later. I know that if I get involved, I won't have to spend time on the job again. I don't have enough units to justify a full-time handyman and independent handymen are not always as conscientious as I would like. They are often motivated to get the job done as fast as possible and to get to the next job.

For the larger jobs, I always want someone who is a professional, I definitely want him to know more than I do about the job. If he doesn't, I don't want him. I also make a point of asking him things about the job where I already know the answers. If he doesn't have the right answers, I don't want him. But for the larger jobs, I won't tackle those myself.