under the table follow up

I denied the young woman who worked as a nanny under the table due to not having verifiable employment. I didn't want her because she has the loser boyfriend who doesn't work and has arrests, and I know he would be slacking in the apartment.

When I let her know she was denied, her response was "I'm really depending on this place, if I have my mom co-sign, would that make a difference? I'm in the process of getting another job now and I'm very conservative with the $20,000 I have now.

She has a $20,000 inheritance, but no real employment verification.

Her mother called me and left a message...she wants to talk to me about her co-signing. She seems stable, but I haven't run her credit yet....

Just wondering how much mom would stick her neck out.....

How do you all handle co-signers...do you always take them if they have good credit?

--32.215.xxx.xx

under the table follow up (by Ken [NY]) Posted on: May 6, 2019 7:40 PM
Message:

You found a way not to take her because you don't want the loser boyfriend so why consider her with the mother co signing? the loser boyfriend will still be there.Just stop communicating with her --72.231.xxx.xxx

under the table follow up (by S i d [MO]) Posted on: May 6, 2019 7:46 PM
Message:

We already answered this question, and the answer is No.

I take co-signers for "fixable issues." Fixable issues include things like first time renter (i.e. no chance to have plus or minus land lord refs) or a borderline high debt to income ratio, but everything else is good.

Them there are unfixable issues. Dipstick loser non-working boyfriend criminal who stacks people in your unit contains several not fixable issues. If you take this persons and post later about problems, most of us are discrete enough not to post any "told ya so's"....but we'll be thinking it.

Do. Not. Do. It. --173.20.xxx.xxx

under the table follow up (by WMH [NC]) Posted on: May 6, 2019 7:52 PM
Message:

We never take co-signers for any reason. --50.82.xxx.xx

under the table follow up (by JKJ [MA]) Posted on: May 6, 2019 8:01 PM
Message:

You didn’t want her because of the boyfriend, you found a way to deny her. The mother co-signing does nothing to address the “loser boyfriend, who doesn’t work, and has arrests” Her sob stories are already causing you to doubt your decision. So block both their numbers and keep looking for a better tenant. --71.248.xxx.xxx

under the table follow up (by 6x6 [TN]) Posted on: May 6, 2019 8:06 PM
Message:

I went back and read your original post and as Sid pointed out everyone has suggested to say no and I agree.

If you let them in you will have problems.

Just hold out and get a better tenant. This one will cost you time and money. --73.120.xx.xxx

under the table follow up (by Jo [CT]) Posted on: May 6, 2019 8:16 PM
Message:

Please know that I am NOT taking her. Thanks for all your input. I see there are some that never take co-signers.

I was mainly curious about what other LL's take on co-signers were.

JKJ, I am not doubting my decision. Was a bit curious as to how far out on a limb the mom would go.

I take co-signers for students...their parents do it, but that is different.

This girl is 23! Not good if her mom has to co-sign.

--32.215.xxx.xx

under the table follow up (by Robert,OntarioCanada [ON]) Posted on: May 6, 2019 8:44 PM
Message:

She could be social assistance where working under the table as well. If they find out then social assistance maybe cut off. It is sometimes better to wait for better applicants. It is always better to run a thorough credit check on all adult applicants. --147.194.xxx.xx

under the table follow up (by Oregonwoodsmoke [ID]) Posted on: May 6, 2019 8:57 PM
Message:

I very rarely take a cosigner. When I do, the cosigner has to have excellent credit, tons of income, and I prefer that the cosigner owns real estate.

I've taken a cosigner three times.

1. College student, good credit, good landlord references, a bit short on income. Parents, excellent credit, lots of income, owned their own house plus a vacation house.

2. Recently divorced, always owned her own home, credit good enough, sufficient income. Her physician BIL offered to cosign and, what the heck. I would have taken her without the cosigner, but he offered, so I signed him on.

3. Young couple just back from two years teaching in Korea. Both had credit scores over 800. Both had jobs as soon as they arrived in the area. Landlord references were too old and they didn't have time on the job. Cosigner had credit score over 800, a generous income, owned three houses. (this tenant bought the rental from me, all cash $168,000) --98.146.xxx.xxx

under the table follow up (by Barb [MO]) Posted on: May 6, 2019 9:13 PM
Message:

I don't usually do co-signers. I don't even with my students - I just make sure to get students with parents who won't want to let "Johnny's" outstanding bill be reported to collections. It works. --64.251.xxx.xxx

under the table follow up (by J [FL]) Posted on: May 6, 2019 9:22 PM
Message:

So she gave her mom your phone number without getting your permission, and now mom's calling you...that would be enough for me not to want to deal with them anymore. --72.188.xxx.xxx

under the table follow up (by Stephen [ON]) Posted on: May 6, 2019 9:47 PM
Message:

Whenever I have had an applicant bring up cosigners it has been a marginal applicant with trouble, similar to this case in fact. These are as others have pointed out non fixable issues and a cosigner will only gloss over the grim fundamentals.

This is aside from the fact that in Ontario if you ask for a guarantor or cosigner by law you have to be asking this of all applicants. To only ask selective tenants whose applications are weak has been ruled a human rights violation and is seen as discriminatory. So unless you routinely ask for guarantors of one and all you are at risk of a complaint being made if you accept a guarantor in regard to anyone. The upshot of this rule is that tenants who might have been approved with a guarantor are instead rejected by many landlords because guarantors come with these concerns. So the result of this regulation is that some tenants find it harder to be approved for rental housing. --174.93.xx.xxx

under the table follow up (by gevans [SC]) Posted on: May 7, 2019 7:03 AM
Message:

This is why you do not give a reason for denial (unless your state requires it). If you give a reason, you are giving them an opportunity to come up with a solution. No reason, no solution. --69.80.xx.xxx

under the table follow up (by Busy [WI]) Posted on: May 7, 2019 9:15 AM
Message:

As givens said. Once I have told them I cannot accept them, I don’t give out more information except if it is because of unsatisfied small claims cases. I tell them about those (which they already know about,) so as to encourage them to get paying on those. Of course, the ones who are really persistent will argue that it wasn’t them.

Anyone who makes contact with me again after I have declined gets blocked in my phone. I won’t ‘work with’ someone who does things under the table. I have used a few handy men/women, but, even that, I try to steer away from anymore. Cheap labor usually isn’t cheap. --70.92.xxx.xxx

under the table follow up (by Jo [CT]) Posted on: May 7, 2019 9:34 AM
Message:

Agreed, her mother called me again this morning at 8:30 asking me to call her. Now time to block her.

I did some digging on her and she is in the process of a divorce. She is not in foreclosure, nor do I see any present small claims issues. The house is in her name.

What really got me was the girl's response "I'm really depending on this place". So that means she is desperate in some way. The bf will no doubt move in. He was arrested for drunk driving, crashing into a pole and running away, but the best one was his "anger" got the better of him and he punched out a light in the police building after he was arrested. Fine upstanding fellow!

I half expect him to either call or text me some nasty message soon. --32.215.xxx.xx

under the table follow up (by Vee [OH]) Posted on: May 7, 2019 12:43 PM
Message:

Give the boyfriend the number for the mom, you found someone who will help them... --76.188.xxx.xx

under the table follow up (by J [FL]) Posted on: May 7, 2019 5:36 PM
Message:

You made the right decision...they are desperate and it sounds like there are too many cooks in the kitchen in this scenario. --72.188.xxx.xxx

under the table follow up (by BRAD 20,000 [IN]) Posted on: May 9, 2019 7:01 PM
Message:

Jo,

Stay strong. Protect your self and your business.

It's OK to say no.

BRAD

--73.102.xxx.xxx

under the table follow up (by BRAD 20,000 [IN]) Posted on: May 9, 2019 7:02 PM
Message:

Oh, and market like a crazy person to get more apps to choose from.

One person should never halt your business.

BRAD --73.102.xxx.xxx

under the table follow up (by Jo [CT]) Posted on: May 9, 2019 7:20 PM
Message:

Brad, thanks. It's been tough because I like the kid who lives there, and it's his friend and he really wanted her to move in.. Even though just she applied, her boyfriend did not, as I believe she knew he would never pass screening, plus, it was her "counting on the room" part that came off as desperate.

We say go with our gut sometimes......I really believed that the bf would live there too...do I have a crystal ball? No, but he did not work and was expecting her money to fund him. I just felt that there would be trouble ahead. Did I make the right choice? I think so, but I could have been wrong too.

I second guess myself ALOT, and I don't like it, nor can I find a way to not do it. I'm not the "tough skin" type, I don't like hurting people's feelings. Ive been doing landlording for 12 years and have been successful, but the be tough and walk away part is always hard...... --32.215.xxx.xx

under the table follow up (by Jo [CT]) Posted on: May 9, 2019 7:20 PM
Message:

under the table follow up (by CGB [MI]) Posted on: May 11, 2019 8:32 AM
Message:

If you own a single family home you technically do not have to "deny" their application. Tenant, "Did I get the house?" Landlord, "Unfortunately, the house has been offered to another applicant." Using this terminology, and returning their application fee if I did not pull a credit check, I have never had someone question my motives. Last rental I had two outstanding applicants, credit scores above 800, verified garnishable funds. The guy I did not accept never put up a fuss. They always know, subconsciously, there is a better applicant out there than them. --67.149.xxx.xx

under the table follow up (by JKJ [MA]) Posted on: May 11, 2019 9:07 PM
Message:

Jo, I mentioned that due to their sob stories you are doubting yourself, you said you weren’t doubting yourself, then in a later post confirmed I appear to have been correct, you were/are doubting yourself. I’m not saying this to be mean or insult you. I’m a firm believer in “gut feelings” which you had regarding this tenant and her boyfriend. You made a decision based on your experience and gut, don’t let their sob stories cause you to doubt yourself, that is exactly what they are hoping to accomplish with the sob story and the mother continuing to call after you gave your decision. You have been at this 12 years and have been successful, obviously you are making good decisions. Don’t look at it as your being unkind or your decisions are causing hurt feelings. I look at it this way, I have a prescreen criteria and a lease, I have the criteria to protect myself and screen out what would be a potential problem tenant. It’s not my fault they don’t meet the criteria. As far as enforcing my lease, my tenants agree to the terms when they sign the lease, it’s not unfair of me to hold them to it, no more than it would be unfair of a tenant to hold me to maintaining a safe and habitable unit. Stick to your guns and don’t doubt your decisions. As I read your post I was thinking, why was this girl counting on your apartment to the point she has her mother calling you several times, surely you aren’t the only apartment for rent in the area, if you want to question anything question what you may have missed that is making her so desperate for your unit? Again, I’m not saying any of this to be unkind, you seem like a very kind, considerate person. --174.199.xx.xxx

under the table follow up (by Jo [CT]) Posted on: May 12, 2019 7:16 AM
Message:

JKJ thank you so much for your kind words. Yes that's exactly how I was feeling. I knew from the beginning that this boyfriend was no good and when I met them, they were both going to move in but then when I got the application it was only her on it. I still do believe my initial gut feeling that they all had an agenda. They knew he would not pass my screening so it was easy to keep him off the application but as soon as she got the keys, he would be right there with her.

Yes, the mother calling and this girl seeming desperate raised the red flags. You are right, I'm sure I avoided an unpleasant situation down the road. --32.215.xxx.xx

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