moved in 2 cats.
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moved in 2 cats. (by Mike [MA]) Apr 19, 2019 12:29 PM
       moved in 2 cats. (by WMH [NC]) Apr 19, 2019 12:39 PM
       moved in 2 cats. (by 6x6 [TN]) Apr 19, 2019 12:44 PM
       moved in 2 cats. (by WMH [NC]) Apr 19, 2019 12:50 PM
       moved in 2 cats. (by WMH [NC]) Apr 19, 2019 12:52 PM
       moved in 2 cats. (by plenty [MO]) Apr 19, 2019 1:04 PM
       moved in 2 cats. (by WMH [NC]) Apr 19, 2019 1:29 PM
       moved in 2 cats. (by 6x6 [TN]) Apr 19, 2019 1:42 PM
       moved in 2 cats. (by Jim In O C [CA]) Apr 19, 2019 1:46 PM
       moved in 2 cats. (by Vee [OH]) Apr 19, 2019 2:06 PM
       moved in 2 cats. (by JKJ [MA]) Apr 19, 2019 3:19 PM
       moved in 2 cats. (by 6x6 [TN]) Apr 19, 2019 3:33 PM
       moved in 2 cats. (by JKJ [MA]) Apr 19, 2019 3:52 PM
       moved in 2 cats. (by JKJ [MA]) Apr 19, 2019 3:56 PM
       moved in 2 cats. (by 6x6 [TN]) Apr 19, 2019 4:05 PM
       moved in 2 cats. (by J [FL]) Apr 19, 2019 5:20 PM
       moved in 2 cats. (by plenty [MO]) Apr 19, 2019 8:21 PM
       moved in 2 cats. (by WMH [NC]) Apr 20, 2019 3:47 AM
       moved in 2 cats. (by DJ [VA]) Apr 20, 2019 4:52 AM
       moved in 2 cats. (by Oregonwoodsmoke [ID]) Apr 20, 2019 7:29 AM
       moved in 2 cats. (by WMH [NC]) Apr 20, 2019 8:23 AM
       moved in 2 cats. (by JKJ [MA]) Apr 20, 2019 9:15 AM
       moved in 2 cats. (by Wilma [PA]) Apr 20, 2019 10:55 AM
       moved in 2 cats. (by WMH [NC]) Apr 20, 2019 1:50 PM
       moved in 2 cats. (by JKJ [MA]) Apr 20, 2019 2:14 PM

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moved in 2 cats. (by Mike [MA]) Posted on: Apr 19, 2019 12:29 PM
Message:

After new tenant moved in the handyman says he sees 2 cats in the unit. This is a pet free unit and tenant claimed no pets. (I'm wary that he will find any Dr to write him a note that this will be a companion animal after the fact of tring to remove them. Any thoughts? --96.236.xxx.xxx




moved in 2 cats. (by WMH [NC]) Posted on: Apr 19, 2019 12:39 PM
Message:

Text your tenant: "What's with the cats?"

Then judge your next response by her answer.

If it is in any way related to ESA, watch how she phrases it. Then tell her in order to make reasonable accommodation for her, you will need reliable proof (and the HUD website does say reliable now!) that she has a disability, and that the cats are necessary to assist her with her disability in order for her to live in the home.

Hud is covering all their bases by calling all allowed animals "assistance animals" it seems.

If she just says "OOPS!" or "I'm cat sitting" you can give her immediate notice to cure.

I would also require THREE litter boxes for two cats, scooped daily, until it is all figured out. --50.82.xxx.xx




moved in 2 cats. (by 6x6 [TN]) Posted on: Apr 19, 2019 12:44 PM
Message:

You are probably right that they will claim ESA.

You might be able to do something about it sense they did not claim any pets when applying. You would be able to prove this in court.

Good catch by the handyman.

Did you by chance do an in home visit when they applied?

Did you call previous LL's?

Sorry you are having this trouble. I am over this ESA mess and I only have one rental. --73.120.xx.xxx




moved in 2 cats. (by WMH [NC]) Posted on: Apr 19, 2019 12:50 PM
Message:

6x6, if you own under 3 units, you are exempt from Fair Housing rules except in your advertising. You cannot use discriminatory language in an ad no matter what. --50.82.xxx.xx




moved in 2 cats. (by WMH [NC]) Posted on: Apr 19, 2019 12:52 PM
Message:

And more and more I am reading that the tenant has to REQUEST accommodation, preferably in writing. YOU have to allow it, if it meets the tests, but they do first have to request it.

So right there she has screwed up if she tries to go the ESA route. --50.82.xxx.xx




moved in 2 cats. (by plenty [MO]) Posted on: Apr 19, 2019 1:04 PM
Message:

I would follow my lease which says i give them 5 day notice to quit ( the volation ) or move. And on the 6th day i will be by at XtimeX am/pm to verify that either the cats are gone ( violation corrected ) or that they have moved. --99.203.xx.xxx




moved in 2 cats. (by WMH [NC]) Posted on: Apr 19, 2019 1:29 PM
Message:

The reason I *didn't* suggest that, Plenty, is because of this $X&*%)#*) ESA issue.

If you just ask about the cats, she *MIGHT* respond honestly, or at least poorly for her case. If you push her against a wall with a legal notice, she might get advice before she answers. --50.82.xxx.xx




moved in 2 cats. (by 6x6 [TN]) Posted on: Apr 19, 2019 1:42 PM
Message:

WMH, do I understand correctly that I do not have to except ESA because I have only one unit? Thank You for letting me know this. Where is this information listed? --73.120.xx.xxx




moved in 2 cats. (by Jim In O C [CA]) Posted on: Apr 19, 2019 1:46 PM
Message:

My last cat did over $6000 damage. The smell was so bad we had to wear respirators for the first three days. --99.23.xxx.x




moved in 2 cats. (by Vee [OH]) Posted on: Apr 19, 2019 2:06 PM
Message:

If you can't train them, trade them... --76.188.xxx.xx




moved in 2 cats. (by JKJ [MA]) Posted on: Apr 19, 2019 3:19 PM
Message:

6X6, do you live in the building? The law WMH refered to only applies to owner occupied buildings with no more than 4 units. Here is the law copy and pasted from HUDís Fair Housing Act..

ďThe Fair Housing Act protects people from discrimination when they are renting or buying a home, getting a mortgage, seeking housing assistance, or engaging in other housing-related activities. Additional protections apply to federally-assisted housing.

Learn about the History of the Fair Housing Act, and read Examples of the many forms of housing discrimination.

Who Is Protected?

The Fair Housing Act prohibits discrimination in housing because of:

Race

Color

National Origin

Religion

Sex

Familial Status

Disability

What Types of Housing Are Covered?

The Fair Housing Act covers most housing. In very limited circumstances, the Act exempts owner-occupied buildings with no more than four units, single-family houses sold or rented by the owner without the use of an agent, and housing operated by religious organizations and private clubs that limit occupancy to members.Ē --71.248.xxx.xxx




moved in 2 cats. (by 6x6 [TN]) Posted on: Apr 19, 2019 3:33 PM
Message:

The Fair Housing Act covers most housing. In very limited circumstances, the Act exempts owner-occupied buildings with no more than four units, single-family houses sold or rented by the owner without the use of an agent.

JKJ, thank you for the information. I do not live in the rental but it is a sfh rented by the owner, so if I am reading correctly then the second part would apply to me? --73.120.xx.xxx




moved in 2 cats. (by JKJ [MA]) Posted on: Apr 19, 2019 3:52 PM
Message:

6X6, thatís copied right off HUDís webpage, and thatís how I interpret it. I donít know if your state has different laws, you should check your state laws. In MA owner occupied 2 unit buildings are exempt, but MA law is different that federal law for the other types of housing. --71.248.xxx.xxx




moved in 2 cats. (by JKJ [MA]) Posted on: Apr 19, 2019 3:56 PM
Message:

6X6, remember what WMH said, regardless of HUDís exemption you CANNOT use discriminatory language in your ads. And remember thatís Federal laws, your state laws may differ, check your state laws. --71.248.xxx.xxx




moved in 2 cats. (by 6x6 [TN]) Posted on: Apr 19, 2019 4:05 PM
Message:

Thank you JKJ for the reminder to check state laws. --73.120.xx.xxx




moved in 2 cats. (by J [FL]) Posted on: Apr 19, 2019 5:20 PM
Message:

Are they required to notify you that they are getting an ESA (after they're living there), or can they just bring it in without even mentioning it to the LL? --72.188.xxx.xxx




moved in 2 cats. (by plenty [MO]) Posted on: Apr 19, 2019 8:21 PM
Message:

Think I'll start a private club. Members but have qualifications much like screening for tenants. And only members in good standing can live in my homes. Call the cat tenant up and ask. Most likely they are cat sitting for a friend and by how they are back home. --99.203.xx.xx




moved in 2 cats. (by WMH [NC]) Posted on: Apr 20, 2019 3:47 AM
Message:

Search for EXEMPTIONS to HUD, Fair Housing, etc. The fewer-than-3 unit wording is out there. --50.82.xxx.xx




moved in 2 cats. (by DJ [VA]) Posted on: Apr 20, 2019 4:52 AM
Message:

6X6: Also study your state's LL/Tenant laws carefully.

Here, owners with just a few properties can also be exempt from some of the requirements. --68.10.xxx.x




moved in 2 cats. (by Oregonwoodsmoke [ID]) Posted on: Apr 20, 2019 7:29 AM
Message:

I'd be very cautious about claiming small landlord exemption for ESA. The exemption is for the protected classes and I would not be confident that it extends to service animals and ESA until there are plenty of court cases that affirm that.

Judges sometimes do what they personally think is right and don't necessarily follow the law exactly and I don't want to be the landlord who is the test case.

In fact, I'd be very cautious about turning down an applicant for race just because I only owned a couple of rentals and the law says I am exempt. I don't think that would go well in court. --98.146.xxx.xxx




moved in 2 cats. (by WMH [NC]) Posted on: Apr 20, 2019 8:23 AM
Message:

Here's something from NOLO:

When the Fair Housing Act Applies

The FHA applies to mostóbut not allótypes of housing.

Types of housing excluded from the FHA include:

* Owner-occupied buildings with four or fewer units. The FHA generally isn't applicable when a building has two to four units, and the owner lives in one of them.

* Single-family homes rented without a broker. The FHA doesn't apply when a single-family house is sold or rented without a broker, so long as the owner doesnít own more than three houses.

* Religious organizations. If you're a religious organization leasing apartments at a property that you're not operating for a commercial purpose, you may legally limit occupancy or give preferences to people of your organization's religion. However, the FHA points out that this exception is strictly limited to religion and cautions that a religious organization still can't discriminate based on race, color, or national origin (42 U.S. Code ß 3607(a)).

* Private clubs. If you're leasing apartments on behalf of a private club and not for a commercial purpose, the FHA lets you limit occupancy to your club's members.

* Senior housing. The FHA includes "familial status" as one of its seven protected classes, which refers to the presence of at least one child under 18 living in a household. However, although the FHA bans discrimination against families with children, you may be exempt from this ban if your property qualifies as senior housing. Exempt properties include those that fit the rules of 55 and older or 62 and older communities, or those that participate in a federal, state or local senior housing program.

Itís important to note that even if your property is exempt from the FHA because of one of the reasons listed above, you must still comply with the law's ban on issuing discriminatory statements, notices, or advertising (42 U.S. Code ß 3603(b)). --50.82.xxx.xx




moved in 2 cats. (by JKJ [MA]) Posted on: Apr 20, 2019 9:15 AM
Message:

Oregonwoodsmoke, I agree with you that I wouldnít turn down based on race, religion, color, etc etc because I think the judges would also frown upon that. With that said I donít allow pets, or ESAís, (Iíve never been asked, but I would allow a service dog). But also as you pointed out I donít want to test the waters so I deny based on other reasons found in my screening process. It may be legal, but I donít want to have to pay attorneys fees fighting to prove it. Itís the difference between legal and lawful, theres the law, then how the judge interprets the law. --71.248.xxx.xxx




moved in 2 cats. (by Wilma [PA]) Posted on: Apr 20, 2019 10:55 AM
Message:

While WMH's information seems to indicate that those who offer for rent sfh's without the help of a broker are exempt, I feel as Oregonwoodsmoke does - I don't want to be the test case for my state. PA tends to have highly liberal judges, and I don't want to lose my shirt over something like this.

I agree - say, "What's with the cats?" and wait for the answer. We had a tenant who ignored our lease clause that animals were not even allowed temporarily. But when I drove into the neighborhood to check on the roof and siding after a storm and encountered her walking the dog (after I had seen the leash tether on the front porch post already), I simply stopped, greeted her and the dog, and asked what was up. "Oh, my mom was in the hospital and my sister was away, so I brought the dog here - he's going home today!" I reminded her of the lease clause, she said that she'd "forgotten", and that it wouldn't happen again.

Dog was gone the next day. No damage, fortunately. --71.175.xxx.xx




moved in 2 cats. (by WMH [NC]) Posted on: Apr 20, 2019 1:50 PM
Message:

I wasn't even thinking of RACE sheesh. Were you? Never mind.

No I was thinking of the ESA scammers. --50.82.xxx.xx




moved in 2 cats. (by JKJ [MA]) Posted on: Apr 20, 2019 2:14 PM
Message:

WMH, No I wasnít thinking of race, I just started typing the different protected classes. The only 1ís I would deny are people with pets and or ESAís (not including service dogs) and young children. (I live on the first floor) But as I said even though the law says as an owner occupied 2 family I can, I deny for other reasons rather than test the legal water. --174.192.xx.xxx



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