If you had a decent looking rental applicant who wanted to be completely upfront and honest with you and admitted to you that he had a past incident in which he had to register as a sex offender,...how would you handle this?

1. Ask for more details.

2. Reject the applicant

3. Accept the applicant (assuming all other rental requirements were met)

Roy....buddy!

I know we've discussed this before, but you may have missed the threads.

The issue isn't what's in the past, nor is the issue their current level of "honesty" about the problem.

The Past: Sex offenders can get on the list for a variety of issues 18 year old having sex with 17 year old GF up to violent rape. Is that messed up, to treat these two cases the same? You bet!

The Current: Honest is all well and good. Thanks for letting me know. People are honest with me about a lot of things....things that help me make wise decisions that may have major impacts on my business and personal life.

The Future: Someone (neighborhood busy-body, etc) finds out there's a sex offender living in Roy's rental. They DO NOT CARE that you did your due diligence of finding out all the facts and/or that the person just took a pee in public 20 years ago. All they know and all they care to know is there is a registered sex offender in the neighborhood. They CAN and WILL smear your name all over the place. And if anything wrong actually does happen. It could be totally unrelated to the SO issue. But the 7 o'clock news (their motto is "If it Bleeds, it Leads") reports: "Registered sex offender living at house owned by Land lord Roy was charged today with..."

Get my drift? People are weird. Logic does not apply in cases like this. Emotions will dictate what they do.

I know the SO registry system is messed up. Are there people on there who don't belong and/or who have paid their debt to society? Certainly. But me allowing them into my rentals is adding a risk for no perceivable benefit. Taking on unnecessary risk to my biz and reputation does not fix our broken legal system, nor does it redress the injustice done to individuals. That's another post for another time.

Sid,

this is one of my few automatic disqualifiers. If the person is on the registry, they can't be in one of my buildings.

I also realize that list is "iffy" in some situations but I am not going to pick through and figure it out. That was that their lawyer was for ... to get them the best deal possible. I would almost guarantee the lawyer tries every time to eliminate registration as part of the plea deals.

Roy, no, it's not the same....but I don't rent to prostitutes or strippers either. Has nothing to do with my personal moral objections to their professions. Simple that their incomes is non-garnisheable.

I've been a Class C land lord since 2005. Never to my knowledge, have I rented to an SO, a stripper, or a prostitute. My vacancy rate is 3% or less.

My point: you do not need to consider prospects with "baggage" that poses a risk to you to have a successful business. I maintain a strong belief supported by many years of success that there are quality Class C folks out there. I signed a lease with a gal last evening whose only problem was bad credit due to medical bills and one delinquent credit card. Easy fix: we doubled her security deposit and going to put her on ACH once we finish setting that up this week. Everything else about her (clean criminal, good LL ref, solid income from stable job, no weirdness on social media, etc) is good and shows me she should be a good tenant. We mitigated her one minor risk.

So my take on this overall...

Fix the things you can fix (i.e. bad credit, 1st time renter).

Don't mess with things you can't fix. If a person's name appears on the SO list, you can't fix that.

"

Fix the things you can fix (i.e. bad credit, 1st time renter)."

so we moved into a neighborhood with homes above 300K in a gated community of 28 homes, found out one of the home owners was on the SO.

Lets just say the entire dynamics changed of the neighborhood, we found out 1 year after he moved in and had already established a relationship.

4. "Have you gotten permission from the local PD to live in this area?"

They have to register with the local authorities, sometimes even before they submit an application, to be allowed to live at an address. Then the PD will check it for proximity to schools and parks and give them the okay.

I had one whose crime was incest with her father. I didn't ask any questions, but we were thousands of miles away from her family. She was the most toe-the-line by-the-rules tenant I had. I lost her when she broke up with her boyfriend and couldn't afford me. She went on to buy a house. Her boyfriend still rents from me, elsewhere.

If it's a topnotch property, I wouldn't consider putting a SO in there. But if it's just your basic clean/safe/functional/no frills place in a factories-and-fast-food neighborhood that rents to people in the lower economic strata, I'd at least find out the basics, how long ago it was, and how likely they'd be to reoffend.

Public indecency and an underage girlfriend are two things that can land you on the registry, vs your child predators and other stuff. You need to figure out what your tolerance is for the grade of their offense, or if you view all offenses as equal.

I'd take an old eviction before a registered offender.

Using PA's court systems out of boredom a while back, I was looking up old tenants I had years ago and found evictions they had before they moved into my units. Those tenancies worked out well overall.

Sid,

I would have more luck garnishing a nude dancer or a prostitute than I would trying to garnish a deadbeat tenant who just got fired from flipping burgers at McDonalds.

Not long ago, I had a female applicant who openly admitted to me she worked as a part-time prostitute with a very discreet clientele. I told her 'your personal life is no business of mind' but I do appreciate your honesty. I did not rent to her but it had nothing to do with her part time profession.

I've had strippers and they start off great. After a few months their pimps move in and drugs start up. This has happened on every occasion.

How on earth are you going to garnish a prostitute Roy? Send the Mafia after her pimp?

I'd love to see the garnishment paperwork go through the court system on that one. Sure would make for an interesting sheriff service at her place of employment.

Roy....that's hillarious!

Like you, I've heard many stories. Every time I think I've heard 'em all....someone comes up with something even more outrageous.

Btw, I wanted to clarify something in my last post. When I "fix" certain things, that's said in a sense of "mitigate."

So with my gal yesterday... I can't "fix" her credit score with a higher deposit...but a double security deposit limits my risk acceptably. When I asked her about that, she responded, "Oh yes, I was kind of expecting to have to do a higher deposit." Nice!

NE,

I have never garnished anyone, mainly because it is not worth my time to chase an unemployed deadbeat over last months rent.

Over the mountains to our east about 30 miles away is a place called Golden Valley. I think it's called that because at sunset the hot, choking, dust hanging in the air from cars driving on dirt roads, mixed in with the fumes of meth labs and pot smokers gives it a golden hue.

It has become sort of a mecca for sex offenders as it's about the only place left where they can live and not be in violation of their release. There's no schools, or parks. Just lots of mobiles on 5 to 40 acre "water haul" lots. And a private prison. I'm on the sheriff's email list and it seems like every day recently there's a new notice of an offender being released to live on some dry ranchette there. It's about as close to being sentenced to live in H3ll as I can imagine.

We are talking level two and three high risk individuals, mostly with crimes against children, not the guy caught peeing by the roadside at night. I'm seeing so many (literally like 20 just recently) I think it's going to start affecting property values in the area. I feel bad for the retired folks who moved there 20 years ago for the beautiful desert scenery and freedom from petty restrictions.

LTD they have at least one sex offender "town" here in Florida too. I think it's down near Lake Okeechobee.

"J" - I've been to the town and lake a couple of times. Wouldn't be surprised. It's like redneck central. At least they have water. :)

Roy AL--- what a waste--- you never garnish?

You have missed the boat Roy. Any LL worth his salt would not only garnish-- but would be good at it. At one point we had upward of 350K in collection. We are down to maybe 100K. Garnishment it's the gift that keeps on giving.

Folks you have not put pencil to paper of this collection stuff and have definitely not done your homework.

I've tried many times here to explain what opportunity your missing-- especially now that everyone is working.

Let's look at just one Roy. Rent for 1 month-- 800.00. It's never really one month because it can be the remainder of the rental contract or at least 1 extra due to improper notice. Court cost and the ol 25% collection fee and 15% interest. Roy lets not forget the damages-- cause we all know if they skip or are excited they don't clean and leave things broken-- so another 1K. 800X2= 1600.00, damages at 1K= 2600.00 collect fee + 650.00 (25%) = 3,250. plus court 200.00= 3,450.00 ---- now comes the 15% per annum 490.00 per year. Roy thats 3900.00 at 15% interest til payed. So you start them all off on payment plans-- all of a sudden you have one house with 3 or 4 past tenants paying-- not rent but collections????

Myob, the downward spiral my ex tenants are in would make chasing their garnishments the equivalent of pig wrestling.

Trust me NE that's every one's excuse because it's not easy to do-- to start with. Believe me we use to say the same thing-- turned it over to a PRO! Yea right PRO--- maybe pro B/S'er.

NE as I said earlier-- once you have the judgment file the garnishment---- it just sits and sits collection 15%. If you get it you get it--- but if you don't try -- YOU'LL NEVER GET THE $.

ne HERE'S ONE OF MY CLASSIC'S-- girl skips out to NY- upstate and thumbs her nose at as as she leaves town. 3 years later she's calling--- I need to pay you she says. I took a job in a stock brokers office and need to get bonded-- I can't get bonded with the judgement.

NE can't you garnish in PA?

For that we use this story. Call the deadbeat or send letter to last known address. WE'RE getting ready to file with you compnay for garnishment would you like to have it delivered by the Sheriff? TO YOU BOSS on the JOB or can we come to some agreement?

Myob,

Myob, I most likely wasn't coming to the convention this year now due to scheduling with my daughters first dance recital, but if you WERE coming, I would fly out the first day to chat with you for a couple hours and maybe dinner and head home. I'd love to hear what you have to say about this business that you DONT write about here. :) You know, the juicy stuff.

My wife would love that, haha. I can hear it now...

In regards to garnishing in PA, I can garnish for back rent, but I'm pretty sure (not 100%) that I can't garnish for a civil judgment. A lot of them become civil judgments after the tenant is out and it's no longer a landlord-tenant situation. So damages after the fact, I really don't know what else to do to collect on them other than leave them active in the court system until these people hopefully one day get their lives back together and need to get some things straightened out.

The majority of mine are civil judgments.

...As you say in PA -- although I don't know why a civil judgment isn't garnishable...

we have no idea why but it's the law.... garnishments do not happen here EXCEPT landlord tenant actions (as NE said, not the civil suits),child support and taxes. If you file for damages AFTER they are out of the property, that is a different type suit so it's not garnishible. don't pay the plumber, dentist, or your credit card? They can't garnish.

Your 15% won't hold water here - it's 6% per the statute.

you can't make a voluntary agreement and have the sheriff enforce it ... they will go through the entire process with the hearing and have a judge order the garnishment.

As NE said, they use some sort of federal poverty guidelines so that matters.

It is expensive to garnish so you need to be certain they won't walk off their job rather than pay.

Nicole PA thank you -- was very informative.

Isn't non pay and filing with the court civil? What else is there "criminal".

You say garnishments do not happen here EXCEPT LL tenant action--? Isn't that what were discussing? That confused me. Here is the scenario and correct my thinking on this please.

Today I received a dep in the amount of 1500.00. rent is 900.00. after 10 months (March of 2019) tenant doesn't pay the 900.00 so I file my civil suit for that non pay of rent. Case has not come to court but tenant answers the court and court date is set. Tenant answers because they know if they answer they'll be given even more time. So I file an amendment with the court since it's now April and add April rent another 900.00. Tenant is also notified per the court. Tenant skips out but we show up for court. Since tenant has answered the court even though a no show to hearing-- tenant has been notified. (if they weren't notified how do they get a court date)? So no rent suit is set and judgment is entered for 1800.00 + court costs.

A little advice about agreements. this is what we do-- it's called a consent agreement. your waiting on court and you agree with tenant how and what will be paid- you both sign-- get notarized and then bring to court clerk for "JUDGE TO SEE AND APPROVE" wE HAVE BEEN TOLD so many times OH! you can't do that? WE do it all the time and it's NEVER been denied by any judge. There is no difference in doing this than being in court and being told to go outside and come to an agreement-- in fact it's the law-- you must try to settle-- so OK we settled a week ahead-- and brought it to court today. all nice in a package sign sealed delivered.

You haven't gotten to damages yet because you haven't gotten the house back?????? (this will be a seperate suit)

Now there's 1500 in damages-- I deduct that from dep. there's still the civil suit and judgment for 1800.00 of rent.

OK so you can't get 15% but I sure would like to see the statue for only 6%? (maybe if you put in lease you could) collection is 25% of total debt which is the going rate--- in the lease also as is the prevailing party can collect legal and professional fees.

We have the same guidelines-- you can only take a percent of work check etc.. etc.. but that's the game. Tenants are not accepted who can not be garnished and who have not been on the job long term. THEY ARE NOT QUITTING A 4-7 YEAR JOB. Where they going to go?

Anything worthwhile is not cheap or EASY. You collect back what it costs as part of the prevailing party statement in your lease.

I apologize for being so long but it's complicated covering everything we've learned about going after deadbeats.

MYOB, thank you for sharing. Tenants are not accepted who can not be garnished and who have not been on the job long term.

IMHO, this is the essence of what causes the improvement in profitability in a LL bottom line. There are lots of tenants, not all are profitable to deal with.

Sisco has been beating it into my head...and it finally took hold...

ONLY rent to tenants who have decent jobs that are garnisheable. I used to rent to anyone who could document 3x the rent. No more. I demand at least a year on the current job or 90 days on the current job AND at least a year on the past job in a related field. Otherwise, rock-solid co-signers are required.

I'm still sifting thru some of the long-term tenants who didn't meet that criteria, so there will be a few that escape, but as of 18-20 months ago this was my new policy. Going forward, folks who don't pay me today WILL pay me tomorrow...or at some point. But overall, these folks are more responsible to begin with, so odds are fewer judgments to worry about in the first place.

sid MO I'm working on the last sentence of yours.

Honestly-- I like people who pay on time but not paying on time is OK also. I like evictions, I like late fees, I LOVE collections -- 25% collection fee on top of debt-- forget the 15% int -- 5-7-9% who cares it just keeps rolling into itself. AKA compounding.

Think of it as the payday loan that keeps paying. Sid do you think we'd have CCard company's if people paid on time?

myob - Landlord tenant suits are different than "civil" (such as the plumber, doctor, credit card suing you). We can garnish for anything included in our judgment. You cannot get the judgment for future damages so if you want to claim damages after they're out, you file a civil complaint and then need personal service (landlord tenant suits do not require personal service).

oops ... forgot

Nicole thank you. We can't get future rent either on initial suit. To clear up. When you file suit for non pay of rent and tenant Doesn't answer you get the property back ASAP? OK so at least there just not sitting in your place as months go by. What happens here is -- if tenant answers initial court hearing and court date is set-- and TENANT doesn't show for the court date the judgment is issued-- WHY? because tenant answered it is proof they have been served.

Do you amend your court filling if the case goes into the next month? We sometimes try to "get schedule" so it requires a court date the beginning of the next month and amend the initial non pay to get the extra months rent on the calendar.

I'm flabbergasted that LL suits are not civil? Can that be right cause it's not criminal?

Pmh TX yes I need to do better screening. I also need to let tenants trash my places - own massive rent and then say "it's not worth going after them".

Unlike most we don't want nor do we get PERFECT tenants-- where's the income in that?

Using your 20% formula won't work to well because people come and go on the collection/garnishment calendar. He's one example from this past Friday. A previous tenant who owed about 5K paid for about 1 year and then declared B/K. We got notice Friday that the BK tenant is no longer protected from BK court due to missing BK guidelines and payment schedule. We can now go back after and start collecting again. So some fall off the rolls-- but we've learned to keep up with even those-- it's not an isolated case either.