Yesterday, I had unexpected meeting with a rental applicant and I had to tell him to his face,..."I will not be renting to you". When he asked why, ...I just said I would rather not say. He then gets pissed at me and tells me "Kiss my @#$% you white S.O.B." --68.63.xxx.xxx

Wait til later and not do it in person. Good way to get your a$$ kicked. My "canned response" is usually "your applicantion was not approved at this time." That's pretty much it. --174.201.x.xx

If you would like more information please send a self addressed stamped envelope to 12345 Somewhere Drive, Rolla MO --72.172.xxx.xx

Your application was not approved at this time. I don’t do this face to face, always by phone. By phone, I can control the situation. --173.216.xxx.xxx

Best plan is to never deny. Explain that you are still taking applications and will notify them if approved. --108.20.xxx.xxx

Everyone is offered an application,if they turn it in and I am interested in them I go over it with them whether in person or on the phone and tell them what I need,if I am not interested in them I ignore it since it is usually incomplete in some way I simply ignore them,i just don't answer the phone,most that are denied just don't call more than once,they know a knowledgable landlord doesn't want them.I see no reason to call someone to reject them,that just invites problems --72.231.xxx.xxx

I went to change the locks at this house,...I did not invite this applicant to meet me there,...he just happened to be there when I arrived. It was a weird situation where I had no choice but tell this applicant to his face he will not be renting this house. --68.63.xxx.xxx

What else happened? --74.37.x.xxx

Yeah, good advice. I told someone "no" at a showing a couple of years ago and she went ballistic. Never make that mistake again. --72.188.xxx.xxx

I don’t to reject anyone. When asked this question either in writing or verbally I just responded “I have accepted someone more qualified”. More qualified could be higher income to rent ratio, longer time on job or lower debt to income ratio. --75.22.xx.xx

Gee Roy, maybe you need to start carrying concealed. That is a bad situation. Never hurts to have an equalizer on your side. --50.45.xxx.xx

I would have told him that decision hasn't been made yet --72.231.xxx.xxx

I once got cussed out on the phone by someone who couldn't get past my pre-screening questions and then started begging and then got mad when that didn't work. What was he doing at the property in the first place? --209.122.xx.xxx

Works peacefully every time. --99.59.x.xxx

--66.87.xxx.xxx

"I'm sorry, we are unable to offer you the property at 123 Main St. at this time. We wish you the best in your search for a new home." --204.210.xxx.xxx

This person has been turned down numerous times hence his reaction. Rather than address the red flags, he wants to engage in transference; you're the problem, not him. I like the idea of saying that a more qualified candidate was chosen, you wish you had more houses and you'll contact him if something comes up. Afterwards, block his number. That defuses the situation and cuts contact. --209.122.xx.xxx

At some point, all landlords have to meet prospects /applicants at the house they have for rent. When two applicants show up at the same time and one gets jealous over the other applicant,...this is what happened here. I know I did not handle this situation correctly. --68.63.xxx.xxx

--72.188.xxx.xxx

If he's desperate for housing, then a dramatic change is needed to clear red flags. Some folks get frustrated that "no one gives me a chance" but don't want to do what's required to establish the sort of track record deserving of a chance. Like I said, no one with options gets mad because someone else is shown a rental. That only happens because he's been turned down several times and he's frustrated. --209.122.xx.xxx

If I don't wish to rent to someone I tell them that all applications are reviewed by the owners and they will make the selection. Those who are rejected are told, via a rejection letter, that a more qualified applicant was approved. If there is push-back, I ask for a self-addressed stamped envelope to be sent to me and I will use it to return an explanation from the owners. --24.125.xxx.xxx

I am still showing this house and taking applications. Most prospects / applicants who see the inside of this house see their future 'dream house' since this house has all of the bells and whistles that other nearby rental houses don't have. I do get premium above market rent for this house. --68.63.xxx.xxx

As landlords, we all get irritated when an applicant lies on his/her application,...but are we supposed to return the gesture and lie to them? --68.63.xxx.xxx

It's over now, but you made an enemy. --50.82.xxx.xx

I am currently rehabbing a house right now. Without any For Rent sign in the front yard, I have Class C & D prospects who show up daily wanting to know if this house is available for rent. If I don't keep the doors locks, these same people will walk right in without knocking. --68.63.xxx.xxx

I think your question is one of the best. It’s an area I know I am always refinining. To me it comes down to be really clear on rental criteria and then emphasizing the early screening process so by the time I’m showing the apartment and taking applications, it is only to those who meet them that are applying. Easier said then done sometimes. Easy with the cut and dry (have pets or don’t meet income requirement). More difficult when it comes to potential red flags. I used to think that I had to give everyone the opportunity to rent my place if they applied and met income/background check more or less, but now I view it more like a job application. Sure basic requirements need to be met to apply but there is other criteria spelled out and the best candidate will be selected for the “job”. And that’s where I think it can get tricky. I am updating my criteria so I can be in integrity with my process. For instance last vacancy I set up a tour for a woman and husband and just as we were hanging up she said “Great, we will be there... with our three kids.” I lost my voice and said “OK.” Shoot! Missed my opportunity(to be honest). Figured she would screen herself out when she saw this relatively small and refined 2BR apartment. Nope. They loved it. Did I mention all 3 kids were under 5 (1,3, & 4). And they were in a protected class. It took my nervous system an hour to calm down after the tour. One child screaming and crying, another running up and down stairs, the other touching everything. Parents were doing the best they could. Professional and appropriate. But 3 kids under 5! In my newly updated, new carpet, freshly painted .... apartment. Anyway, I pretty much blew it in terms of handling the situation gracefully from there and now have it in my crieteria “no more than 2 per room.” I’d like to put a rating system from no kids to kids but not sure.... I think staying in integrity (honesty) right from the start is best as the alternative leads people to come to their own conclusions which is often worse than the actual. And it can bite us in the butt or put us in the situation where we are on the defense, avoiding direct confrontation. And if we’ve been doing this for more than a minute, we’ve all been there. No fun! Good luck! --172.58.xx.xx

But normally, I don't tell applicants face to face because of the small percentage of them that get unreasonably hostile. Those few make it difficult to give a rejection by phone and I sure wouldn't want to be within fist swinging distance of them. --174.216.x.xxx

I tell them on the first phone call, we do a credit/background check, looking for 3 time the rent as income - guided by our grandfather in housing HUD, walking pets requires photo vet records along with 150 for registration fee, standard deposit is 2 time rent value. If you tell us about background we still maybe able to help you, we don't look much at medical or student loan debt. --76.188.xxx.xx

--72.188.xxx.xxx

--98.146.xxx.xxx

I am now considering making a separate post with these details,..which are complicated and have racial overtones to them. I will make this post on Monday morning after I have had time to think about it. I feel sure some of you all have had to deal with a similar situation. --68.63.xxx.xxx

Thanks, RG! Didn’t realize “familial status” was a protected class and now I see... “The FHA, to date, includes seven protected classes: race, color, religion, national origin, sex, disability, and familial status. This last term refers to the presence of at least one child under 18 years old, and also protects prospects and tenants who are pregnant or in the process of adopting a child.” (Thankfully hadn’t actually employed anything in violation of this). Still seems OK to do the 2/room criteria..I hope! I actually have a family that started with two kids and since two additional kids from previous marriage moved in. It’s a rough scene, they are busting at seams, 4 in one room, 2 parents in other. --172.58.xx.xx

When we received rental application and I can not decide, I will keep asking for more information to proof rental and job history. --97.91.xxx.xxx

In PA we aren't required to provide a reason for denial, we just need to make sure we are consistent from a fair housing point of view. Don't feel you need to post your reasons for denial publicly. --100.6.xx.xxx

I would simply tell him his application didn't pass the rental criteria when he asks. You know he'll probably follow it up with something like: Why not? Tell him the business requires him to send a request accompanied by a self addressed stamped envalope to address so on a so forth and he can find out that way. It won't stop him from telling you to KMA but it does transfer the bad guy to the business and lets him be mad without feeling like he has to act on it with you since his ego's on the line. Oh, and birds of a feather sometimes flock together so be careful with that distant relative. --174.233.x.xxx

Thank you for having shared what happened and best of luck with renting your place. --67.188.xxx.xxx

What would you have done in this situation? --68.63.xxx.xxx

Turn him in to the Feds for getting into your mailbox. --50.45.xxx.xxx

Remember, they're all out to get you! --74.37.x.xxx

They could have looked at my house, paid application fee, applied, I then would have seen there is no reason to leave my office. --72.172.xxx.xx

I would have simply told him I haven't received her application yet and I need both before I can process them. --72.231.xxx.xxx

I'm with Ken. --50.82.xxx.xx

To those who seem shocked that the guy came back. A lot of my applicants all come back. they come look again, show it to someone else, they live in the area, have family or friends in the area, etc. --72.70.xxx.x

In the scenario you described I would have told him that they both had to submit applications and the application fees had to be paid prior to processing the application. Once that had been done then you can proceed with not approving the application assuming they don’t meet your criteria. I tend to send letters to all unapproved applicants. I have a form letter with check-the-Box reasons that I send out. If they catch me or call before receiving the letter then I tell them they were not approved and they will be receiving a letter in the mail. --166.137.xxx.xxx

With what you just described, I think Ken was spot on with the best reply. And no I wouldn't have been there or waited around for him to go get her application and bring it back. They can afford a stamp to mail it. --174.233.x.xxx

Roy,i don't tell them no directly to there face for 2 reasons,number 1 for safety for both myself and them,if they started a fight or something I might get hurt but I also might win and they might get hurt or dead,i see no good reason to get in a fight that could have been avoided.number 2 is I simply don't want to listen to them whine and cry about being fair or giving them a chance etc,it is easier and quicker to say that decision has not been made yet or I need her application still as opposed to trying to explain to someone that I wont rent to them and the reason is because you are really a dirtbag and I dont want to have to evict you in 3 months and end up in an argument --72.231.xxx.xxx

I'm with Ken as well. The process was not complete, so you were in no position to formally evaluate (even though you knew it was a non starter). Also, he wasn't going to be living there so why take an app from him anyway? I wouldn't have rented to them either. There would have been all kinds of drama. He must have been lying and planning on living there anyway. --172.58.xxx.xx

--68.63.xxx.xxx

Roy, if you are not doing digital applications, meet them at a gas station or coffee shop. Meet them in public for the applications. And even then don't answer any questions, push it off to your boss or whatever kind of smoke and mirrors game you need to play. If you're not playing one, you need to start. --174.201.xx.xxx

Years ago, I use to meet tenants at gas stations (at night) to collect rent until Jeffrey told me just how stupid that is. I don't do that anymore. The mailbox drop-box system is convenient and I don't have to wait around for the tenant to show-up at a certain time. Your completed application is either in the mailbox or it is not. --68.63.xxx.xxx

PS, I always met them half way, about 5 minutes from my house. :) --74.37.x.xxx

Also, what I used to do was meet the good ones at the gas station and have the deadbeats mail it in. For some reason, I was always busy that day and not able to meet the deadbeats. Slow em down.... --74.37.x.xxx

Roy, I generally have those who've passed pre-screening complete the application on the spot. I tell them to bring ID and proof of income with them while I pre-screening them. I use the pre-screening process to nip a lot of stuff in the bud. If someone insists on taking an app to complete later, they have to fax it and text me a picture of their ID. They can pay the app fee via paypal, zelle or just western union it to me if they wish. I don't travel for apps per se. That creates a hurdle that gets rid of deadbeats. Those who are ready and who have their stuff together have no problem completing it on the spot. Do you charge an app fee? Sounds like you don't and that also is a hurdle. In this guy's case, an app fee would have probably kept him away. --209.122.xx.xxx

If I am showing it in person fill it out on the spot and give it to me and I go over it and tell them what I need as far as paystub etc.If not in person they found me on facebook or craigslist so I have a website so fill out the app on the website and submit it that way.If need be they can fax it to me.If they cant do any of them there is no way I am meeting them or driving back to the rental just for an application,not worth the time,put it on them to get it to you. --72.231.xxx.xxx

For a few bucks you can get a PO box and have them send it there. --50.45.xxx.xxx

--24.194.xx.xx

I actually made a serious attempt in a polite professional voice to explain to the baby daddy (he is 68 years old) why this was not going to work out. I told him his name would be on the lease and he would be responsible for a lot more than just the deposit and 1st month's rent. And if he was not willing to accept this additional financial responsibility, then this arrangement is just not going to fly with me. This is when he got pissed off and told me to KMA. If anyone had a knee-jerk reaction, it was him,..not me. --68.63.xxx.xxx

--72.188.xxx.xxx

Roy, You lack online applications. This is at the very least costing you time and aggravation. --72.172.xxx.xx

--68.63.xxx.xxx

He took it personally because he is an immature self centered little brat,regardless of his age,and he could have just as easily pulled out a knife as called you names and left.Not to mention this is the person who is likely to put in some kind of fair housing complaint.He doesn't care about your requirements,he just wants what he wants and if he doesn't get it then it is someone elses fault because that is his maturity level --72.231.xxx.xxx

The house, library or fastfood indoor table so you can get a photo of each guv issued ID - and that adds to the wait time, you are trying to help them but someone who followed instructions accurately and quicker is now under the lease, keep my number and check every 6 weeks till we can get a match. --76.188.xxx.xx

Landlording is a PEOPLE BUSINESS. You have to learn how to deal with PEOPLE (all personality types too) to survive and prosper in this business. I just need to get better at telling someone NO without pissing them off. --68.63.xxx.xxx

Hey, you need to get better at telling them nothing and from a distance. --174.201.xx.xxx

Start thinking about how to deal with the situation before you respond,if only for a couple seconds,you will get better at it pretty quickly.Dont be judgmental,there is nothing low income tenants hate worse than someone they perceive as wealthy trying to tell them how they should live or spend there money,respect is a big thing among low income people,please and thank you costs me nothing but they really seem to like that.At my best I actually get thanked at eviction court by the tenant I am evicting,that is when I know I did a better job than the other landlords at court. --72.231.xxx.xxx

If I wanted to tell them nothing and from a distance, I would hire a Property Manager. Isn't that what PM's do best? LOL. --68.63.xxx.xxx

Since becoming a LL in 2005, I have had hundreds of similar face to face conversations with rental prospects and applicants. 98% of those were cordial and nobody went away mad or upset. It is those occasional 2% that do get pissed off when they do not get what they want and they are the ones who call me a slumlord and other choice names. My skin is thick and I can handle it. --68.63.xxx.xxx

I didn't want to hear it at first but it was right...just wait until they are gone if you're going to tell them anything. --72.188.xxx.xxx

my wife can tell you how to say no... --166.137.xxx.xx

--98.250.xxx.xx

Tell them "We will select (or have selected) the best applicant" Never make it about the individual or their application, - that makes it personal and starts a discussion/argument that will not end well. --99.101.xxx.xx

ANOTHER reason to NEVER tell prospects/applicants/tenants you are the owner! You are a property manager and the OWNER has final say on all issues -- including application approvals!!! --68.41.xx.xxx

Please be careful when turning down applicants. In MA, I don't think landlords can decide how many people "fit" in an apartment. Likewise, you can't turn down people for race, religion, marital status, etc. With an owner-occupied duplex, I am tempted to be subjective, but have found that choosing the first person whose application meets my criteria is generally safest. I don't want to be sued! --63.119.xxx.xx

I think you have to lie sometime because what if a well qualified single mother with a brat(kid out of control at viewing)applied. I can't tell her I wont rent to her with this destructive kid because the housing authority would be up my arse. I have to dig deep to find a legal reason to deny her. --107.77.xx.xx

Happily, as the owner-occupier of a Duplex in Boston, I don't have to rent to little kids. It's the only discrimination that's allowed. Of course, some might prefer a toddler to a teenager! --63.119.xxx.xx

Thanks again to everyone for contributing --71.36.xxx.xx

I hear you all! We had a potential tenant come by while we were beginning to show the house to another family. This applicant wanted to show the house to some of her family members that were in the car waiting. I needed to stay on schedule with the "showing" appointments that day. We told the applicant that we were booked and that if she wanted to make another appointment we would accommodate her in 2 weeks. (We remembered her from her first visit ...were not particularly impressed with things she said she wanted to do...like not liking neutral paint colors or trying to convince us about how clean she would keep the place)So we crossed her name off the list right away...to picky...too needy...don't want a call every day because something isn't up to par for her...After our selection was made (as promised to all applicants) we called each one and only say that they were not selected. If a reason is needed it could be as simple as "we were unable to verify employment or past tenancy with another landlord or some info on the application was missing is a good excuse that gets the blame off you and places it on either the completion of the application or one of the sources they supplied. It's out of our hands. We DO tell our applicants that we WILL be verifying all info they've given us and to notify HR that we will be calling (or their current landlord)because if we cannot get verification of info ...the application will not be considered at ALL. Actually talking to their supervisors and landlords has given us some incite to the lifestyle and work ethics and has been VERY helpful for decision making for us. --98.15.xxx.xxx

We only receive applications via email and also provide acceptance and denial via email. We use a form that provides a written reason for denial. This provides proof of reason that avoids equal opportunity issues...or anyone claiming we gave an illegal verbal denial. If asked in person, we tell them that the "applications department" will be getting back to them in writing either way. --65.101.xx.xxx

Dan --71.36.xxx.xx

Dan --71.36.xxx.xx

Learned a big lesson on this experience. I had a couple submit applications after a showing. During the showing, they described their great jobs, great rental history,.. and oh by the way, we have a small credit issue. I told them their applications sound very promising. Their screening reports had credit issues that were unacceptable and lengthy. I called the husband and told him unfortunately I could not approve them due to their credit history. The guy said, "but I told you about our credit history and you said it sounded promising?" I responded, "after reviewing the reports there were too many credit issues. I'm sorry it didn't work out. Thank you for your applications and all the best in your new home search!" The next day I received an email from the Better Business Bureau that I had an A rating with stating a consumer had complained that I told them they would be approved and I declined them. I was called a liar, a thief and that I was deliberately deceiving them to get their application money. I was so upset! I don't operate that way at all. The BBB said all consumer complaints must be documented publicly and posted on my business page. I contacted the applicants again to discuss their complaint. They said if I refunded their application fees they would delete the complaint. My web site says fees are not refundable. I felt used but knew it was a small price to pay to assure quality applicants. So after paying for all of their reports I refunded their application fees and they didn't file a false report. I lost money but I learned to never say, "your application sounds promising." I say, "I won't have answers for you until all reports are received and all verifications are complete." --24.111.xx.xxx

Dan --71.36.xxx.xx

My process is simple. In the first discussion we discuss income and pets. I ask where do they live now and why are they moving. If it is because of their landlord, I ask who it is and what is going on. I try to check their public records while on the phone. I ask questions like, "tell me about the incident you were involved in in January of 2018?" Or "tell me about the eviction on 2016" This get them to either keep going or not. If there is no background of concern, I schedule a showing. At the showing I reference my partners or management. I tell them,"I like you, tell me what they are going to see on your credit and background so I can explain it when your application is reviewed." This puts them on my team and they discuss freely what we will see. I usually tell them in the showing, "Oh boy, may partners or management will not approve that, tell me more" If they are worth while they will get tot he point of filling out my application. I need EVERYTHING filled out with supporting documents, signatures, ID's, check stubs, all at once. Don't say no, this will leave you open to a suit, just ask more questions about the stuff that disqualifies them and they will eventually lie about it. I want to approve everyone, so I need them to help me get to that point. --24.14.xxx.xxx

Jeff, how do you find about their eviction etc before they complete an application and concent to you checking them? --98.250.xxx.xx

We can access most county records online for free. For instance in Winnebago County in IL we go to: http://fce.wincoil.us/fullcourtweb/start.do and follow the prompts. If you Google "Online Court Records Your County Your State" you will probably get your county's online court record system. If you can't find it, call your County Clerk and ask if they have an online system. If you give me your county, I'll even try to find it for you. No consent is needed to access public records. I look them up like this while on the phone if I can. I use my computer, smart phone, etc. for real time look ups. If I am on the phone, I will put them on speaker and have them spell their name while I enter it. Again, this will allow your prospective resident to know YOU are looking and if they are bad, many hang up or say forget it. NEVER accuse them of something as some records are dismissed or they are found not guilty, etc. I just ask them to tell me about... what ever I want. --24.14.xxx.xxx

That is very smart! I will try it. Thank you so much! --174.230.xxx.xxx

Dan --71.36.xxx.xx

https://www.courts.oregon.gov/how/Pages/find.aspx --24.14.xxx.xxx

--71.36.xxx.xx

I've only had to call the police one time for one that was denied who showed up at my office screaming at me. So it is on record and no invitation to apply again. --76.216.xxx.xxx

--71.36.xxx.xx

I agree with Roy - I never lie to applicants. I take several applications and choose the best one. That's my answer. "I have chosen the best application of the ones I have". Then I wish them the best in their search.... --69.88.xx.xxx