Tenant refuses
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Tenant refuses (by Chris [NJ]) Dec 15, 2018 9:18 PM
       Tenant refuses (by plenty [MO]) Dec 15, 2018 9:22 PM
       Tenant refuses (by Richard [MI]) Dec 15, 2018 10:13 PM
       Tenant refuses (by Chris [NJ]) Dec 16, 2018 4:23 AM
       Tenant refuses (by NE [PA]) Dec 16, 2018 4:25 AM
       Tenant refuses (by RB [MI]) Dec 16, 2018 5:17 AM
       Tenant refuses (by nhsailmaker [NH]) Dec 16, 2018 5:20 AM
       Tenant refuses (by NE [PA]) Dec 16, 2018 5:27 AM
       Tenant refuses (by myob [GA]) Dec 16, 2018 5:43 AM
       Tenant refuses (by plenty [MO]) Dec 16, 2018 5:45 AM
       Tenant refuses (by Still Learning [NH]) Dec 16, 2018 5:58 AM
       Tenant refuses (by WMH [NC]) Dec 16, 2018 7:57 AM
       Tenant refuses (by LindaJ [NY]) Dec 16, 2018 8:05 AM
       Tenant refuses (by Tony [NJ]) Dec 16, 2018 8:11 AM
       Tenant refuses (by Ed [PA]) Dec 16, 2018 8:31 AM
       Tenant refuses (by 6x6 [TN]) Dec 16, 2018 9:19 AM
       Tenant refuses (by plenty [MO]) Dec 16, 2018 9:36 AM
       Tenant refuses (by NE [PA]) Dec 16, 2018 9:39 AM
       Tenant refuses (by rick [NJ]) Dec 16, 2018 10:34 AM
       Tenant refuses (by 6x6 [TN]) Dec 16, 2018 10:57 AM
       Tenant refuses (by AllyM [NJ]) Dec 16, 2018 7:43 PM
       Tenant refuses (by fred [CA]) Dec 16, 2018 8:17 PM
       Tenant refuses (by myob [GA]) Dec 17, 2018 4:25 AM


Tenant refuses (by Chris [NJ]) Posted on: Dec 15, 2018 9:18 PM
Message:

Experienced Landlords,

My husband and I have a tenant who's lease ends June 31st of 2019. I have sent a letter 90 days prior asking if they were going to vacate or renew their lease, they didnt respond. My husband went to the tenants apartment and gave them the new lease, they refuse to sign it. They also said they dont know when they are leaving and if they have to stay past the January 31st date, then they will. If they find something sooner, they'll leave then. They might use the security deposit as rent and lastly they also said they will not let us show the apartment to anyone until they leave.

In the 15 years we've been landlording we've never had a situation like this. We feel our hands are tied. NJ is a tuff state and I'm not sure what to do at this point? --108.50.xxx.xxx




Tenant refuses (by plenty [MO]) Posted on: Dec 15, 2018 9:22 PM
Message:

Maybe they will tell you on March 31 ?

--99.203.xx.xxx




Tenant refuses (by Richard [MI]) Posted on: Dec 15, 2018 10:13 PM
Message:

June 31st ?? Did you mean Jan 31st for the end of the lease?

Looks like what you have here is a case of "the tenant thinks they are in charge".

Time to immediately let them know in no uncertain terms that the LANDLORD is in charge. The tenant is not!(Thanks, Aldo).

These people do not care one iota about you, the lease or the rules you set down. They are bullies, to use a term often in the news these days. You either let them get away with it and they smear your face in the mud or you make them regret the day they thought of it. Your choice.

Immediately:

No more verbal communication. It's past that. Send a letter TELLING them you are NOT renewing their lease and they are to be out by noon on Jan 31. TELL THEM you will check for cleanliness and damages AFTER they move and send any refund of security deposit within the time allowed by your state.

TELL THEM per the terms of the lease, security deposit is NOT allowed to be used for last month's rent. If they try it, FILE FOR NON PAYMENT of rent on the first day late and follow through.

TELL THEM if they holdover past Jan 31, they WILL PAY the holdover rent rate (hopefully you have this amount and clause are in your lease. If not, add it today).

TAKE NO CALLS FROM THEM UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES. written communications only. Keep copies of all paperwork, texts, voicemails for court if needed.

If you don't already have them, get a copy of your states landlord/ tenant laws and learn and follow them.

From experience, I can tell you if you let them bully you or if you listen to their stories, you will lose a lot of money (thousands) and have your house trashed.

Gettough and follow through on the very first day.

--23.121.xx.xxx




Tenant refuses (by Chris [NJ]) Posted on: Dec 16, 2018 4:23 AM
Message:

Thank you Plenty for your response, yes, I meant January 31st. --108.50.xxx.xxx




Tenant refuses (by NE [PA]) Posted on: Dec 16, 2018 4:25 AM
Message:

You're 6 months out, not a big deal. I don't know why people get in such a tizzy over renewing leases at year end. Let them go MTM. Most of the time people stay. If they leave with no notice, whack their deposit. Don't let them use the deposit as last months rent, if they try that, evict them.

I think you created you're own headache here.

--50.32.xxx.xx




Tenant refuses (by RB [MI]) Posted on: Dec 16, 2018 5:17 AM
Message:

Agree, NE.

Some more LL created Chaos. --184.53.x.xxx




Tenant refuses (by nhsailmaker [NH]) Posted on: Dec 16, 2018 5:20 AM
Message:

I would notice them that you are termination the lease

be 100% sure you are following NJ laws

As Richard [MI] says - everything in writing and I do certified letters and hand posted on door also --73.182.xxx.xxx




Tenant refuses (by NE [PA]) Posted on: Dec 16, 2018 5:27 AM
Message:

But why terminate the lease though? Leave the situation alone, set up your lease to go MTM at year end and assume they're staying. You already got a year out of them, they are either keepers or tossers at this point.

Renewing with a new lease gives a landlord ZERO control in whether they stay or not. The same rules are in place with an ongoing MTM vs a new year lease.

To put them out because you want them to renew for a year and they won't do the paperwork, is just control freak stuff. It creates a vacancy where one isn't necessary. Even if you get a new 1 year lease, they're going to leave if they want to.

It's an illusion of security in a sense. Plus, it's one less interaction to have with the tenant. I like zero tolerance, but I like zero interaction even more! --50.32.xxx.xx




Tenant refuses (by myob [GA]) Posted on: Dec 16, 2018 5:43 AM
Message:

I also believe these tenants are trying to RUN you. You have a contract to follow. Our renewals are clear. Should you decide not to renew another year and go month to month there's a large increase in rent for that privilege.

It's not so much we hate MtoM but our vacancies are regulated as to how many lease expire on certain months. We adjust our leases both new and renewals so we don't have 63 due January 1 or all due May 1.

We also don't personally serve the renewals to tenants-- we mail them. There is 2 copies sent with instructions on where to sign and a return envelope that requires postage. If not returned you go automatic m2m. --99.103.xxx.xxx




Tenant refuses (by plenty [MO]) Posted on: Dec 16, 2018 5:45 AM
Message:

Perhaps... you can just wait to see what they do. After lease expires and they are still there... i ... in my state... could offer them another one years lease with same terms... sign here or go month to month, 30 days notice to increase rental amount. Yes it msy feel they have the upper hand, just know what you CAN DO and be prepared to run your business. Easy to get caught up in what tenant can do... disregard that for now and embrace your power of What Can You Do? --99.203.xx.xxx




Tenant refuses (by Still Learning [NH]) Posted on: Dec 16, 2018 5:58 AM
Message:

What does your lease say? Does it say they go month to month or does it say they become a holdover tenant. My holdover tenant clause doubles their rent if they don’t sign a new lease or leave by the end. They have stayed no showing while they are there. I would abide by that. I agree with others that said send a letter with parts of your lease copied that need to emphasized, know NJ law and spell out exactly what there options are, what is expected and what will happen if they don’t follow the lease, including filing for non-payment. --107.77.xx.xx




Tenant refuses (by WMH [NC]) Posted on: Dec 16, 2018 7:57 AM
Message:

What is notice requirement for M2M? As I've said many times before, here in NC it is only 7 days before end of current lease period. So a tenant could tell me on the 23rd that they are leaving on the 30th, and I can't ding their SD or anything like that.

So we insist on a written lease with specific notice written in because 7 days is simply not enough time to find someone else, or to do any fix-ups or repairs either. --50.82.xxx.xx




Tenant refuses (by LindaJ [NY]) Posted on: Dec 16, 2018 8:05 AM
Message:

I don't like to show a unit until the tenant is out anyway. Do you need them out by January 31, the middle of winter? Or are YOU better off if they do stay a few months more, at a higher M2M rate. Send them the notice of increase in the rent in the period required. If you notice them by the end of Dec in my state, the rate increase can be effective Feb 1 when they become M2M. If they don't pay that rent, off to court to evict. --108.4.xxx.xx




Tenant refuses (by Tony [NJ]) Posted on: Dec 16, 2018 8:11 AM
Message:

I'm guessing you mean 1-31-2019 not 6-31-2019. Please clarify.

Some moving parts are state specific. We don't know the written terms of your lease but if they are NJ typical, you should be given 30 days WRITTEN notice (on a calendar month basis - ex. not June 9 thru July 9). Also you MUST offer to renew a lease in NJ unlike PA and some other states. You don't have to renew a NJ lease if the tenant has habitually violated their lease (late pay, extra people moved-in, etc.) AND you have sent properly worded NOTICE TO CEASE letters.

In short it appears your tenant has assumed control of your business - at least in their eyes - regarding what is proper move-out notice, length of lease, how THEIR security deposit will be applied, etc. They will also educate you on what is considered normal wear and tear. That lesson will be administered to you after they move out.

If you'd like us to help more, can you tell us what your written lease says about each point you raise here? --73.215.xxx.xx




Tenant refuses (by Ed [PA]) Posted on: Dec 16, 2018 8:31 AM
Message:

Send a notice before Dec 31 that you will be raising the rent at the start of the new lease beginning Feb 1. They will either move out Jan 31 or they will pay rent on Feb 1. If they pay the new higher rent you have an implied acceptance of the new lease terms under contract law. If they pay the same rent or no rent you serve a Notice to Quit and start eviction. When they receive the Notice to Quit they will either comply and pay the higher rent or they will be evicted.

As others have offered:

The Landlord is in charge, the Tenant is not. --71.112.xxx.xxx




Tenant refuses (by 6x6 [TN]) Posted on: Dec 16, 2018 9:19 AM
Message:

Ne(PA),If the tenants would not sign paperwork how would you get them to sign a new lease going MTM or do you just send them a copy of the new lease that states it is going MTM and they do not have to sign it? I love your advice,I am just trying to get it clear in my head how that works. Thank you for your response. --73.120.xx.xxx




Tenant refuses (by plenty [MO]) Posted on: Dec 16, 2018 9:36 AM
Message:

I suppose the question is Do you want to retain them? --99.203.xx.xxx




Tenant refuses (by NE [PA]) Posted on: Dec 16, 2018 9:39 AM
Message:

6x6, just a lease clause that states at the end of the 1 year lease, the lease automatically renews on a MTM basis with the same rules, regs, and notice requirements in place. --50.32.xxx.xx




Tenant refuses (by rick [NJ]) Posted on: Dec 16, 2018 10:34 AM
Message:

As Tony pointed out It sounds like your rental fall Under NJ Anti eviction statute if the case you Must renew the lease unless you find Just clause under the statute and follow the notice requirement timeline and proper wording

Be careful about some of the advice given, while the poster meant well, some advice violate the NJ Anti eviction act for example jacking the rent at the end of the lease, if the tenant balks on the rent increase the LL bears the burden of Proof in curt to show the rent increase is reasonable or any change in the lease terms the LL bears the burden of Proof to show the change in lease terms is reasonable

Also make sure your rental is registered or you cannot bring a cause of action in LL/tenant court --73.197.xxx.xx




Tenant refuses (by 6x6 [TN]) Posted on: Dec 16, 2018 10:57 AM
Message:

Thank you NE. --73.120.xx.xxx




Tenant refuses (by AllyM [NJ]) Posted on: Dec 16, 2018 7:43 PM
Message:

You can't just end a lease in this state. It goes to month to month. You have to formally evict in court and you have to have a reason like nonpayment of rent. Now, you can just send them the new lease with a letter that says the lease has ended and they must move by February 1, but if they would like to remain in the building they must sign the new lease. If they do not sign and return the lease, and remain in the unit, that means that they agree with the lease and must follow what the lease says. You have to sue that wording or similar. Your lease is ended. Here is the new lease. If you want to remain please sign and return it If you do not sign and return it but remain in the apartment that is the same as signing and returning the lease and it will be in force. --73.248.xxx.xxx




Tenant refuses (by fred [CA]) Posted on: Dec 16, 2018 8:17 PM
Message:

I offer tenants a new lease when the original lease expires, and if the tenants doesn't jump on the offer, the rental agreement turns into M2M.

This is court tested and accepted by the judges.

M2M gives me the freedom of raising the rent whenever I want. --99.59.x.xxx




Tenant refuses (by myob [GA]) Posted on: Dec 17, 2018 4:25 AM
Message:

NE I would think almost ever lease has the auto renewal. This is where LL's get lazy though. They let it go so that means no increase (unless an auto 5 or 10% is in that paragraph).

We have the auto renewal but 45 days prior to lease expiration we send out a one sheet form. Select renew and at what price or go MtM at a larger price. Wording continues on lease renew addendum "all other terms of the lease shall remain in force". Must be returned in 15 days or as the addendum says you go to the month to month rate. Which is a whooper!!!! --99.103.xxx.xxx





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